Shooting dogs

[Ade8mm]

I suspect this may have been covered before but let me ask a specific question.
Background. We have a near neighbour with a GWP. It has bitten numerous people, even dog walkers on a nearby footpath.
It has attacked and killed two of another neighbours cats (not when they were on the dog owners land - refrain from comments on personal thoughts about cats please)
We were asked by another landowner if we could put our sheep in her orchard to graze the grass, nearby to where this dog lives. We declined as we know the dog, which kills anything. I found the carcass of a Roe that had clearly been killed after a struggle with a dog (evidenced by the pins everywhere, the wounding and the flattened undergrowth) I have no evidence it was this dog but it is the most likely suspect.
My question. Given all my rifles are aolq and I have an open certificate, if I was to see this dog attacking my sheep or indeed my dogs or any of my other animals on my land, would I be wrong to shoot it with a rifle -especially if that is what I had with me at the time, or say whilst cleaning said rifle, and observed it attacking my livestock and shot from a window etc, (as opposed to a shotgun- for which the law is quite different)?
Or would this bring down a world of pain on me?
Ade

 

[Woodsmoke]

If the dog is attacking your sheep, on your land, you've actually caught it in the act, and you have no other option, then technically you're not in breach of either your FAC, or your rights, to shoot it. However, you leave yourself open to a potential private prosecution should the owners of the dog decide to sue. You don't have the legal 'right', per se, to shoot the dog, but you do have a legal defence for doing so, provided you can justify your actions. I truly hope it doesn't come to it though.

Sections 3 and 9 of the Animals Act 1971 covers this:

Animals Act 1971

An Act to make provision with respect to civil liability for damage done by animals and with respect to the protection of livestock from dogs; and for purposes connected with those matters.

www.legislation.gov.uk

Animals Act 1971

An Act to make provision with respect to civil liability for damage done by animals and with respect to the protection of livestock from dogs; and for purposes connected with those matters.

www.legislation.gov.uk

Of course, AOLQ should cover you as a dog attacking livestock is, strictly speaking, 'legal quarry'. I certainly wouldn't want to put it to the test though . . . . .

 

[NP435]

How is a biting dog allowed to live? In my state if a dog bites the owner loses the dog and its killed. Morally I think you shooting it is a good thing, the legal matter I cant say. The phrase shoot ,shovel and shut up come to mind.

 

[Freeforester]

I suspect this may have been covered before but let me ask a specific question.
Background. We have a near neighbour with a GWP. It has bitten numerous people, even dog walkers on a nearby footpath.
It has attacked and killed two of another neighbours cats (not when they were on the dog owners land - refrain from comments on personal thoughts about cats please)
We were asked by another landowner if we could put our sheep in her orchard to graze the grass, nearby to where this dog lives. We declined as we know the dog, which kills anything. I found the carcass of a Roe that had clearly been killed after a struggle with a dog (evidenced by the pins everywhere, the wounding and the flattened undergrowth) I have no evidence it was this dog but it is the most likely suspect.
My question. Given all my rifles are aolq and I have an open certificate, if I was to see this dog attacking my sheep or indeed my dogs or any of my other animals on my land, would I be wrong to shoot it with a rifle -especially if that is what I had with me at the time, or say whilst cleaning said rifle, and observed it attacking my livestock and shot from a window etc, (as opposed to a shotgun- for which the law is quite different)?
Or would this bring down a world of pain on me?
Ade

Discretion is the better part of valour...

 

[Ade8mm]

Discretion is the better part of valour...

Always, in actions freeforester
( Or do you mean don't post the question?)

 

[Ade8mm]

How is a biting dog allowed to live? In my state if a dog bites the owner loses the dog and its killed. Morally I think you shooting it is a good thing, the legal matter I cant say. The phrase shoot ,shovel and shut up come to mind.

Yes . Used to be the same in England. No more I am afraid

 

[Jon P]

I have shot a number of dogs worrying livestock over the years, farm I used to work on was next to a large housing estate and sheep worrying was a constant issue, The farmer was happy to sacrifice one sheep as long as the dogs were shot and killed so we always had plenty of evidence if an owner ever complained. Remember to inform the police after the event if you want to be legal. - neighbouring farmer did have a warning from fire arms licensing as he used rifle once instead of shotgun. That was a good 20 years ago though. Lots of dogs are still shot in my area now.

 

[L1A1]

I do not believe AOLQ will cover dogs as they are PROPERTY of the owner and not quarry. Also your FAC would need conditioning "for protection of livestock".
The

 

[Scandially]

......"red sky at night"
(shepherds house on fire for shooting the Pikeys dog)?

 

[Ade8mm]

I do not believe AOLQ will cover dogs as they are PROPERTY of the owner and not quarry. Also your FAC would need conditioning "for protection of livestock".
The

That is the sort of thing I need
Tnx L1A1

 

[Ade8mm]

......"red sky at night"
(shepherds house on fire for shooting the Pikeys dog)?

He aint a Pikey he is a lawyer and so is his wife . (Mine is too bit she can't advise on this one)
In an aside my best man at our wedding said "It was always a given that Ade8mm would marry either a Lawyer or a Nurse as he will on occasion he need the help of both"

 

[Scandially]

Have you made him aware of the consequences? It is probably not the dogs' fault. Good luck.

 

[Mossypaw]

My previous certificates always had ‘protection of animals’ as one of the conditions, now the only condition is ‘lawful quarry’
I have shot dogs before as it was legal, but are they lawful quarry ?

 

[rms364]

From my experiences of dogs killing sheep, the dogs aren’t standing still for long enough to get a shot off with a rifle and that should be a safe shot. Considering you’ll be hyper p*ssed off and angry I’d say leave the rifle in the cabinet tbh. Use a shotgun if you have to, even buy one if need be, for one stray rifle shot could do a lot of harm to a person or your certificate.
I wish you all the best with this situation, not nice I know from experience!

 

[baguio]

That is the sort of thing I need
Tnx L1A1

Doesn't make the advice correct though!

 

[Sinistral]

How is a biting dog allowed to live? In my state if a dog bites the owner loses the dog and its killed. Morally I think you shooting it is a good thing, the legal matter I cant say. The phrase shoot ,shovel and shut up come to mind.

Your avatar says you're posting from Wyoming. The state law there doesn't say that …. it appears to be firmly on the side of the dog.

Joe Biden in Washington DC also gets away with an unruly dog by all accounts.

Wyoming Dog Bite Law

A dog bite victim in Wyoming can recover compensation under the doctrines of negligence, negligence per se, scienter and intentional tort. There is no state dog bite statute so this is a “one bite state.” Individual counties and cities may have ordinances creating strict liability, however...

dogbitelaw.com

Joe Biden's dog, Major, bites second person in a month

German shepherd ‘nipped someone while on a walk’, then today one of the dogs left faeces on the White House floor

www.theguardian.com

Ade8mm ... official advice for UK sheep farmers:--

Sheep Worrying | National Sheep Association

This area of the website provides lots of advice to help you and your pet have fun and safe days out without disrupting the important work of sheep farmers.

www.nationalsheep.org.uk

 

[Woodsmoke]

I do not believe AOLQ will cover dogs as they are PROPERTY of the owner and not quarry. Also your FAC would need conditioning "for protection of livestock".
The

It looks as though you may indeed be correct on that score:

Worry about shooting worrying dogs | Rural & Agricultural | Sintons Law Solicitors

Tom Wills, Associate Solicitor in the Agriculture & Estates Department at Newcastle based Sintons Law discusses worry about shooting worrying dogs

sintons.co.uk

More reading:

The law on shooting dogs – critical facts farmers must know - Farmers Weekly

Reports of dogs worrying and injuring livestock are widespread, so it’s important farmers and landowners know how to react if confronted by this difficult

www.fwi.co.uk

I reckon the best way to get clarification is through either a specialist solicitor, or your firearms department themselves

 

[slider]

I asked my FEO why protection of livestock had been removed from my certificate at my recent renewal and was told the Police Scotland had stopped issuing this wording as AOLQ was sufficient provided the Animals Act was followed.

Be aware that you can't just shoot a dog because it is near livestock. It has to be in the act of worrying or you have cause to believe it will woory AND there is no other reasonable means to stop it.

 

[Selous]

I was under the understanding that it depends what is being attacked. Livestock are covered in the legislation but domestic pets ie cats may not be. I know pheasants are not covered

 

[Jax]

Is it really worth the agro and potential repercussions? Just report it to the police and they should seize it