Some opinions please, did I mess up?

[HonestJohn]

That’s an impact crater from a bullet that’s not yet started to expand. Hair likely from either a very close shave or just winter coat falling off as she got a big jump scare. You’ll likely have gone too low.

Go back next day(s) and see if she returns - it’s a roe, she’ll be back next day if she’s not, she was hit

 

[wytonpjs]

Skimmed it underneath.
Get closer next time.

Exactly my thinking too! I've only ever shot one deer at those ranges. That was a colleague's runner that was about to leg it off the ground but it was a much larger target (red hind) with no discernible wind. The only time I have shot out further on a range to 600m I was surprised by the effect wind can have.

 

[Donkey Basher]

No skin or other tissue, no blood, no bone just cut hair & a bullet strike behind where the animal was stood - to me this says a (VERY LUCKY) miss underneath!

Slightly higher & you’d have had a difficult job in your hands… a low chest shot can pass under the heart whilst still entering the rib cage. Reaction to shot is likely to be rear up on hind legs, dance around a hit & run off, possibly collapsing after a while but very likely lying head up, trying to get up, get up & run some more, & so on.

It’s been said already & you’ve been man enough to first of all tell the story, not make excuses & humble yourself by accepting what’s been said - as soon as I read roe & 335 yards I was expecting the worst.

Lesson has been learned

 

[Heym SR20]

The other big consideration at a range of 300 plus is the terminal impact velocity, energy, bullet expansion and wound channel.

At a range of 100 your impact velocity will be well above 2000 fps with plenty of energy. The bullet will expand well and you will have a good permanent and temporary wound channel. The temporary channel is key as this is the shock wave that will go several inches either side of the bullet path. In a roe deer this shock wave will have a major impact on all the vital organs, in particular the CNS knocking it unconscious. With a red deer, they have a much larger boiler room, but the shock wave will still affect other organs well beyond the path of the bullet. This results in a quick kill.

Out at 300 plus you much more relying on just the permanent wound channel without much shock wave and temporary cavity. This means that to get a quick clean you need even more precise in your point of impact and shot direction. At 300 most cartridges will have lost a good proportion of their velocity and energy leading to less certain expansion and small permanent and temporary wound channels.

If you can hold a 4” group on a range where you have time to get everything set up perfectly, this will easily open up to 6 or 8” group when in the field. Add in some elevation, wind, excitement and less than perfect set up the ability to precisely hit the target diminishes rapidly. And if you don’t hit it precisely, you don’t have the bullet energy to back you up.

Next course of events is to go and buy a 300 win mag with all its attendant costs and recoil.

Much better is to get in closer and reduce the ****up Coefficient considerably.

The ****up Coefficient goes up exponentially with range and doubles every 50 to 100 yards or metres.

We all make mistakes. The biggest mistake is not recognise them. Pressure to achieve cull targets is huge. However I am pretty confident that its better not to shoot at something a bit far. Either get closer or go and find something else. And you won’t waste a huge amount of time following up wounded or missed animals.

 

[finnbear270]

No reflections on the OP, but I would always class a succsessful shot taken at 50 yards or under, to trump one shot at 200 plus ... purely because of your fieldcraft, if you had seen it and stalked in, had been good enough to overcome the quarry's senses.

 

[Mungo]

yes i think your right, if i had hit body I'm sure i would have seen something more than fur. and the impact crater would have been so big due to energy lost when hitting the animal.

yes I'm expecting some critics etc, but I'm big enough and ugly enough to take it, and I'm sure they have made some too, but maybe wont like to admit they have.

yes i think 4 inch group at 300+ yards for roe is a no. iv learnt my lesson here and Roe are safe from me at that distance from now on.

That’s a very sensible response.

And really great to see such an honest post - it’s really useful to have these so we can all learn.

We’ve all made mistakes (in my case, many and varied).

The key is to avoid making the same one twice!

If you do have to shoot at these ranges (and there are contexts where it’s unavoidable), then I can’t recommend a diallable scope enough. It removes the guess work.

That, and a lot of practice.

 

[Tim.243]

No reflections on the OP, but I would always class a succsessful shot taken at 50 yards or under, to trump one shot at 200 plus ... purely because of your fieldcraft, if you had seen it and stalked in, had been good enough to overcome the quarry's senses.

That depends on if you make a move and the deer clock you then leg it, a good example is people shooting foxes over a fair distance as if you try and get closer they will nip in the hedge and gone. They all have a "safe" but deer in an open field to cross you will be struggling to make your 50 yds shot.

 

[Mike1979]

No reflections on the OP, but I would always class a succsessful shot taken at 50 yards or under, to trump one shot at 200 plus ... purely because of your fieldcraft, if you had seen it and stalked in, had been good enough to overcome the quarry's senses.

I love to try and get in close but ironically I shot a fallow doe about 40 yards away and the bugger ran about 40 yards with little reaction to the shot ...reckon I was to close and the bullet was going so fast it didnt expand..and it was copper ..just cant bloody win sometimes

A very good friend of mine isnt very mobile and is a hell of a shot so regularly shoots out to 300 with no fuss and deer on the deck..good old 6.5/284

 

[cjm1066]

Friend was certain he had hit a deer based on hearing a thwack. My dog wasn't interested, got him to return to H/S and shoot the ground were the deer was, heard the thwack clearly.

Everyday is a learning day.

 

[jonylandrover]

The other big consideration at a range of 300 plus is the terminal impact velocity, energy, bullet expansion and wound channel.

At a range of 100 your impact velocity will be well above 2000 fps with plenty of energy. The bullet will expand well and you will have a good permanent and temporary wound channel. The temporary channel is key as this is the shock wave that will go several inches either side of the bullet path. In a roe deer this shock wave will have a major impact on all the vital organs, in particular the CNS knocking it unconscious. With a red deer, they have a much larger boiler room, but the shock wave will still affect other organs well beyond the path of the bullet. This results in a quick kill.

Out at 300 plus you much more relying on just the permanent wound channel without much shock wave and temporary cavity. This means that to get a quick clean you need even more precise in your point of impact and shot direction. At 300 most cartridges will have lost a good proportion of their velocity and energy leading to less certain expansion and small permanent and temporary wound channels.

If you can hold a 4” group on a range where you have time to get everything set up perfectly, this will easily open up to 6 or 8” group when in the field. Add in some elevation, wind, excitement and less than perfect set up the ability to precisely hit the target diminishes rapidly. And if you don’t hit it precisely, you don’t have the bullet energy to back you up.

Next course of events is to go and buy a 300 win mag with all its attendant costs and recoil.

Much better is to get in closer and reduce the ****up Coefficient considerably.

The ****up Coefficient goes up exponentially with range and doubles every 50 to 100 yards or metres.

We all make mistakes. The biggest mistake is not recognise them. Pressure to achieve cull targets is huge. However I am pretty confident that its better not to shoot at something a bit far. Either get closer or go and find something else. And you won’t waste a huge amount of time following up wounded or missed animals.

according to my ballistic data, should have a velocity of 2263FPS at 330 yards, energy of 1477ftlb. the red hind didn't go far, 10 yards maybe and fell over. took the bottom of the heart clean off, exit would was a good 2 inch ragged hole. hence my use of this calibre and bullet at that range without doubt of the effectiveness of the kill.

i hate using the .270 at short range, it makes far to much mess of the carcass and I would rather use my 30-30 out to 150. and usually would not use it on Roe. however the shot was presented to me and i wrongly took it. its not a mistake is shall repeat, Roe are now out of bounds for me at that kind of distance.

 

[jonylandrover]

Friend was certain he had hit a deer based on hearing a thwack. My dog wasn't interested, got him to return to H/S and shoot the ground were the deer was, heard the thwack clearly.

Everyday is a learning day.

yes i was very tempted to walk back over the valley and take the same shot again but without the deer and see what i heard. the impact sight iv never seen before like that after passing through an animal. i think now with all the replies iv had it was a very close shave miss. and the Roe are now a no no at that distance for me.

 

[sikamalc]

Probably gut shot.

It will run off as normal, then couch up quite quickly if its a Roe. But if it sensed you were near it would most likely get up and move on for a while.

I would add that 300 plus yards is in my opinion a bit far to shoot Roe. But that's my opinion. If it was copper bullets it will have gone straight through and little or no damage or blood. If its hit in the grassbag, there will be NO blood. But if you have, you can usually smell it when you get near.

This is where you need a good dog to track it.

 

[VSS]

Probably gut shot.

It will run off as normal, then couch up quite quickly if its a Roe. But if it sensed you were near it would most likely get up and move on for a while.

I would add that 300 plus yards is in my opinion a bit far to shoot Roe. But that's my opinion. If it was copper bullets it will have gone straight through and little or no damage or blood. If its hit in the grassbag, there will be NO blood. But if you have, you can usually smell it when you get near.

This is where you need a good dog to track it.

I doubt a pass-through from a gut shot would have left that much of an impact crater in the ground at that distance.
(Just my opinion, of course).

 

[takbok]

@jonylandrover how did the deer react to shot?

 

[VSS]

@jonylandrover how did the deer react to shot?

Cue @Mike1979 with a whole lot of .270 jokes about how it would have taken him a good few minutes to regain a sight picture after taking the shot......

 

[jonylandrover]

@jonylandrover how did the deer react to shot?

I didn't see enough of a reaction in the scope being at 24x zoom. it had its head inside a hole in the hedge of the wood eating acorns. Then after the shot I dropped to 12x zoom, got back on target it was gone along with the other 2 of its mates, one behind it and the other just below it. Thermal scan showed no heat sources in woods at all.

 

[VSS]

I didn't see enough of a reaction in the scope being at 24x zoom. it had its head inside a hole in the hedge of the wood eating acorns. Then after the shot I dropped to 12x zoom, got back on target it was gone along with the other 2 of its mates, one behind it and the other just below it. Thermal scan showed no heat sources in woods at all.

24x zoom is too high for stalking, for that very reason. Even 12x is pretty high, really.
You need to be able to see what's going on in the immediate area around the target animal.

 

[hendrix's rifle]

24x zoom is too high for stalking, for that very reason. Even 12x is pretty high, really.
You need to be able to see what's going on in the immediate area around the target animal.

So with the joys of day/night scopes, I can actively go through and see what mag i use when taking 'long' range shots.

X12 is what i tend to go with out to about 400.

 

[Dave_45]

things don’t always go our way when shooting.

Just this weekend past I shoulder shot a roe perfect side on and the bullet exited out it’s guts,same shot on 4 other deer that day was in and out in the same spot.

Copper though.


It’s refreshing to see not everyone thinks they are super hero stalkers.

We live and learn

 

[HonestJohn]

The good thing if it got away alive, is the other two were likely kids that would have been left orphaned a wee bit too early.