Stag meat in rut?

[stalker.308]

As you know Andy, I have had fallow in the rut that has tasted awful, I could literally smell urine, and taste it, whilst cooking it, and I have had fallow in the rut that tasted fine (as you can attest to). my experiences with fallow certainly it me off touching rutting animals again, but I once shot a red in the rut that we butchered on the hill and I had no ne of the same experiences I had had with fallow. That said I do not eat a lot of reds! As you also know, goats I have shot during the rut stink to high heaven, but I have been so careful in skinning them the meat has not tasted bad at all. I guess the lessons I have learned is very very careful skinning so that you do not touch the meat whatsoever with clothing/gloves that has touched the skin.

Overall I find rutted meat itself is noticeably different- its less plump, no fat, and therefore a little drier to eat, certainly not the quality of pre rut autumn fat animals.

 

[deerstalker.308]

As you know Andy, I have had fallow in the rut that has tasted awful, I could literally smell urine, and taste it, whilst cooking it, and I have had fallow in the rut that tasted fine (as you can attest to). my experiences with fallow certainly it me off touching rutting animals again, but I once shot a red in the rut that we butchered on the hill and I had no ne of the same experiences I had had with fallow. That said I do not eat a lot of reds! As you also know, goats I have shot during the rut stink to high heaven, but I have been so careful in skinning them the meat has not tasted bad at all. I guess the lessons I have learned is very very careful skinning so that you do not touch the meat whatsoever with clothing/gloves that has touched the skin.

Overall I find rutted meat itself is noticeably different- its less plump, no fat, and therefore a little drier to eat, certainly not the quality of pre rut autumn fat animals.

Cheers Alex! I guess it’ll be one to try, and if it doesn’t pan out well, let the dogs enjoy it!

 

[woodmaster]

Are you not missing the point entirely? You are comparing apples with pears, which is exactly why the op raises the question of whether to shoot rutting stags or not.
Quote

a local farmer who shot a rut stag a couple of years ago, and had it butchered (by the local butcher); the following year he asked me if I knew how to get rid of the 'tuppy' taste of the meat

The following summer he shot a decent staggie and asked me if I would deal with it on this occasion,

So the first animal was a rutting stag and tasted sh##, the second was prior to the rut and tasted good.
I don't see how the cost of butchery has any relevance to the edibility of the meat, unless of course you suggest flavor is merely down to how one butchers the carcass.
Sure your probably the best butcher in the area and take huge pride in your work, so can you make a rutting stag taste nice?
Please enlighten us mere amateur's, as it would be a massive help this coming season given the possibility of not having any game dealers to send them to.

 

[Freeforester]

Nail on the head - you da carpenter!

I'd advise against. And make sure the dogs you feed any to are kennelled, rather than live in.
Point being it's best to shoot them when they are edible and tasty, not just edible, and/or rank.

Only an opinion, mind.

The butcher who did the rut stag has World and UK accreditation and prizes, but as some other old philosopher said, you can make hen 'pen' from honey, but not honey from hen pen (sh##), the difference is knowing whether it's worth the bother, if money is not the motive; personally I'd not even have started, knowing the outcome. In that, the butcher either didn't know, or 'vos only obeying orders'. In sticking to what we know (like the cobbler to his last) and/or conventional wisdom has taught us down through the years, we tend not to go far wrong. But, just as the butcher bigron mentions, one way out of the 'mess' could be to cut it up and sell it to other unsuspecting customers but this time for their dogs to 'enjoy' and of course themselves, once Rover has blown off the covers on the sofa a few times with the assistance of his new 'special' food!); doesn't seem to be much of a long-term strategy either, eh? Still, better than having to stomach it yourself, unless you actually like it or don't find much difference in the taste, as Jubnut suggests. I have to declare I'm with Bogtrotter on the other side of the opinion scale, but I won't try to stop anyone wishing to make a go if it for themselves.

Being self taught, I'm no more professional than yourself or indeed the next guy, I maybe just do more than most, and have a care for my own business and interests, based upon my experience; the farmer mentioned above was in the end happy to heed my advice about how to get rid of the strong flavour, though I've heard some say that if it is frozen for six months or more, the strong taste goes away - I'm not persuaded at all personally, but as I wouldn't give the stuff freezer space in the first place, how would I know, and indeed who would know, apart from those who are sufficiently 'brave' or foolhardy (delete as applicable) to try it?

Reinventing the wheel is not to my interest, but all the same, I'm all in favour of new ideas, if they are of use and benefit; as far as I can tell, you'll just be wasting your time, but others here have already declared different opinions, and like the man reminds us, all are much like a£$€holes, in that they mostly stink. They certainly will in some parts, come the rut!

Maybe as a positive, we can all do the 'rut venison challenge', and (when we're all feeling a little better ) we can share our experiences, albeit from a suitably distant setting! Until we do, the jury is going to be out among those yet to declare.

 

[woodmaster]

I'm with you on. This was the motivation for an earlier thread. Where I questioned the practice of shooting stags in the rut. To bring the meat to market purely as a by product of the hunt, at less than its best does us as stalkers and primary producers no credit. People try this meat and are put off for good. Since the market for using it to make highly spiced sausages seems to have deminished , do we not need to.consider the practice of shooting in the rut altogether?
I once shot a spike which appeared in very good condition. I took it home to fill the freezer. Now whether I did some thing wrong during skinning or butchering I don't know, but it was terrible. Even the dogs weren't too keen. Hence I wonder how many general public are put off after such experience?

 

[Freeforester]

You da carpenter, ^^^this, and it's what I tell my customers too; quite a few have told me the same, when they've bought from other sources: they love venison, or at least when they buy it from this 'amateur', but when they can't wait until next time I'm in the parish and go and buy from some butchers supplying it, they tell me its inedible. One butcher has since ceased trading (one wonders why??), but the main points are these:

1) Why would anyone willingly risk destroying their business and reputation by even offering such stuff, unless they themselves either don't know or do but don't care, and

2) consider how many customers he will have put off the idea of venison for life in offering such stuff, and how this will colour the judgement of those who look at your wares, but, much like the fox who has had the 'aversion-by-foul-tasting-food' lesson, are not persuaded, even though you may be offering some of the best in the land.

We mostly all know how great it can be, but we need to be aware too, of just how awful it can be!

 

[bogtrotter]

I'm with you on. This was the motivation for an earlier thread. Where I questioned the practice of shooting stags in the rut. To bring the meat to market purely as a by product of the hunt, at less than its best does us as stalkers and primary producers no credit. People try this meat and are put off for good. Since the market for using it to make highly spiced sausages seems to have deminished , do we not need to.consider the practice of shooting in the rut altogether?
I once shot a spike which appeared in very good condition. I took it home to fill the freezer. Now whether I did some thing wrong during skinning or butchering I don't know, but it was terrible. Even the dogs weren't too keen. Hence I wonder how many general public are put off after such experience?

Get what you are saying but the real market for stags in the rut is hunting a stag in the rut is worth £600 and you wi!l
at the present time still.get £ 1.70 KG for the carcass you are never going to get that income from the meat alone.
Yes you could shoot them earlier but they are not going to be in hard antler until late August at the earliest
(Highland stags) once they are in hard antler you will maybe get some clients but stags at that time are still congregated
on the high tops in bachelor herds not the best conditions for stalking though not impossible.
By far the most exciting time to stalk stags from a clients point of view is during the rut and that is when money can
be made from them.
For most of us the viable stalking season is probably about three weeks if we are in a hind forest

 

[Wills]

I shot a sika in the rut and took it home. Never again. Terrible.

 

[Robbie45]

Ok, so I must confess, having been stalking reds for many many years now, I have always been put off (probably by preconceived ideas and bias) the idea of butchering for my own use red stags during the rut, preferring instead to let the game dealers have that issue. To date I have never done so, instead filling the freezer with a couple of hinds or calves instead.
Now, I’m thinking as per previous discussions about game dealers etc that more of this years beasts might make it into my own freezer, most likely in the form of sausages, but inevitably some steaks/mince and stewing will also be planned.
So, who has first hand experience of eating rutty stags, and what were your thoughts?
I’m not bothered by the external smells and grot etc, that all comes off with clean skinning, but keen to know if there really is a noticeable change in flavour due to the testosterone?
We don’t generally worry with other species during the rut, but reds seem to have a bit of a reputation. Is it justified?

 

[Robbie45]

I think everyone is the same, you have to mix a rutty stag with 70% other ingrediency. Sad but true, problem is are you after a trophy..
If not tackle the stags in velvet it is so much better and the body has not started to change at this point.

 

[woodmaster]

Get what you are saying but the real market for stags in the rut is hunting a stag in the rut is worth £600 and you wi!l
at the present time still.get £ 1.70 KG for the carcass you are never going to get that income from the meat alone.
Yes you could shoot them earlier but they are not going to be in hard antler until late August at the earliest
(Highland stags) once they are in hard antler you will maybe get some clients but stags at that time are still congregated
on the high tops in bachelor herds not the best conditions for stalking though not impossible.
By far the most exciting time to stalk stags from a clients point of view is during the rut and that is when money can
be made from them.
For most of us the viable stalking season is probably about three weeks if we are in a hind forest

I realise this is a balancing act. With estate and stalker needing to make an income. As I've already said I was fortunate enough to stalk the stags in the rut last year, and a truly memorable experience it was. It had been a experience I never thought I would be in a financial position to take, but given the chance by Moray stalking at what I now realise was a genuine bargain and effort second d to none I'm glad I did that extra work to pay for the days. I do now wonder how I would justify taking a beast for my own pleasure in the knowledge that it's bounty may not be appreciated. Would I pay the same money to stalk a spike in velvet? I'm not sure as I look at the trophy and the value I place on hunting such an impressive e beast.
I guess in the scheme of total deer numbers entering the food chain, rutting stags account for only a small number. Yet the income derived from the experience of hunting them in a magical time of year and the memories made perhaps compensates for failing to get the best of the meat. I only hope an outlet can be found for rhe use of the his meat without it being the cause of putting people off what is generally a great product.
I'm sure there are plenty more people who wouldn't give the situation a second thought, but as someone who is passionate about a part of my life which is akin to a religion I believe we all should question out motive's and ethics from time to time.
I think I need to make some more money and spend on more stalking.

 

[NewForester]

I shot a sika in the rut and took it home. Never again. Terrible.

What about Roe Buck in the Rut? There are lot of videos on calling Roe in during the Rut and so I had presumed that they would be edible.

 

[Freeforester]

What about Roe Buck in the Rut? There are lot of videos on calling Roe in during the Rut and so I had presumed that they would be edible.

Edible, not their best though, noticeably stronger than three weeks before the rut, before the fun begins and the fat begins to burn. (IMO)

 

[Olaf]

I believe, but stand to be corrected, that a lot of the stags shot in the rut are exported to the continent to be made into salami, where the spices mask the underlying flavour.

It’s not that the spices mask the underlying flavours , but rather that the curing process draws off flavours out. And the salt , spices , and sometimes also smoke , can transform some average meat into something delicious. But, Charcuterie has its limitations!
A huge part in the quality of the meat is down to handling, skinning hanging butchering and preparing the meat prior to cooking . For example, hanging a rutty deer with its jacket on isn’t going to help matters. Nor is doing a messy skinning job going to help.
If it’s an old stinker I’d personally not shoot it at that time of year in the first place.

Kindest regards, Olaf

 

[sikamalc]

All the Red and Sika we shoot during the rut in Scotland go to the local gamedealer. Most if not all are moved on and go abroad to my knowledge. I have never wanted to eat a rutting stag. Having skinned/capped off many over the years the smell permeates into your skin, and even with gloves on one can still smell rutting stag when you go to bed.

Fallow are just as bad. In many instances you can smell a rutting buck before you see him, and the meat tends to be very dark. Not for me thanks.

Now a nice Sika hind or a young Fallow doe is much better eating, followed maybe by CWD.

 

[Mossypaw]

In my younger days, before I new better, if I took a ripe beast home my mother would soak the joints before cooking (water with lemon juice, I think) to get rid of the taste.

 

[Sheamus]

I have eaten a handful of middle aged stags over the year`s which were shot during mid September/ October time for my own consumption.
But for the last seventeen years I have had no desire at all to fill the freezer with a barrow load of tangy flesh.
Like our Malc said Fallow bucks are just as bad.. But I`d go further and say there worse. Those Bare Buck`s take some beating come October time for smell..

 

[deerstalker.308]

I think my suspicion on the subject comes from American elk, almost exclusively shot in the middle of the rut? Yet these seem to all get eaten?

 

[bogtrotter]

I realise this is a balancing act. With estate and stalker needing to make an income. As I've already said I was fortunate enough to stalk the stags in the rut last year, and a truly memorable experience it was. It had been a experience I never thought I would be in a financial position to take, but given the chance by Moray stalking at what I now realise was a genuine bargain and effort second d to none I'm glad I did that extra work to pay for the days. I do now wonder how I would justify taking a beast for my own pleasure in the knowledge that it's bounty may not be appreciated. Would I pay the same money to stalk a spike in velvet? I'm not sure as I look at the trophy and the value I place on hunting such an impressive e beast.
I guess in the scheme of total deer numbers entering the food chain, rutting stags account for only a small number. Yet the income derived from the experience of hunting them in a magical time of year and the memories made perhaps compensates for failing to get the best of the meat. I only hope an outlet can be found for rhe use of the his meat without it being the cause of putting people off what is generally a great product.
I'm sure there are plenty more people who wouldn't give the situation a second thought, but as someone who is passionate about a part of my life which is akin to a religion I believe we all should question out motive's and ethics from time to time.
I think I need to make some more money and spend on more stalking.

But the point is that the venison does not go to waste there is plenty demand for it on the Continental market there
may be a glitch in that market at the moment but it will come back.
The demand for venison on the home is very small compared to that on the Continent which is where most of UK
venison goes whether in the rut or not.
As for the price paid by Game Dealers there is no difference in the price paid throughout the season we lose nothing by
by supplying them with stags during the rut.
The only thing that influences the price paid for venison is supply and demand.
Also bare in mind the differences in the law between Scotland and England in Scotland all venison being bought or sold
must pass through a registered venison dealer ,the trained hunter exemption does not apply in Scotland so any individual or estate wishing to sell venison to anyone other than a registered venison dealer must become a red
venison dealer with all that that entails ,some have gone down that road with varying degrees of success but it is not
for everyone.

 

[Dunwaters]

I personally wouldn’t touch them.
The meat tends to be tainted, as soon as it hits the pan the smell permeates the whole room, sika are particularly bad.
With reds the quality is less predictable, I’ve had some that were sweet as a nut and tender enough to cut with a spoon, in late September and others that were rank and tough enough to make you consider vegetarianism. Either way you end up with a lot of it.
Fill your freezer with stags as early in the season as possible and then move to hinds and calves.
Sell the rutting stags, with prices as low as they are there’s no point in selling the prime carcasses.