Uk air rifle licensing

[reiver]

What’s your thoughts on the storage of the air weapons. I always believed that it was fine in a cupboard out of sight of casual visitors to your address. Not according to the FLO who came out to do my renewal recently, they insisted that it must be in a firearms cabinet or secured with a metal cable to a wall to prevent that casual visitor leaving with it under their arm as they wave you goodbye.

Mine were just stood in the corner of my gun room when I had my last inspection in August . No comment by my FLO .

 

[Brittany boy]

Yip, she was a very opinionated female, was making it up as she went along, what she thought was right, was right , even if no legal backing. Admitted she wasn’t into shooting and didn’t really understand the different calibers and their uses, but it was a better job than being on the shifts dealing with individuals with mental health issues and neighbour disputes. That’s the problem we as shooters have, the people implementing the legislation are putting their personal slant on things without any actual knowledge.

 

[NullMac]

Indeed......complete overreaction to one tragic incident in particular and a sop to the hand wringing brigade. Sadly, this meant that hundreds, if not thousands of air rifles were handed in to be destroyed, this also meant that the half-wits who went around taking pot shots at people/dogs/cats/birds/cars/buses can still carry on doing the same as they don't give a stuff about any legal requirements anyway! Added to that the miscreants know that the chances of getting prosecuted or caught by our ever diminishing Police force is between slim and bu*ger all!
If the Government does contemplate this in England, please feel free to make the point that it has made no difference to criminal usage of air weapons and just penalised the law abiding.

Actually that's not true.

Numbers below are ballpark and from my recollections of data I got a couple of years back from a Freedom of Information request. So if they are not exact don't crucify me. The gist is correct though.

If you look at the statistics that are reported for "firearms crime" over 50% of them relate to air 'weapons'. That always gets my goat because they are not bloody firearms. Of the 50% that are actually firearms/shotguns 80% of the offences relate to pistols.

So actually there is a strong argument for having them on a ticket given the incidence of 'crimes', and that was without being in possession without a ticket being a crime.

It is illogical to argue that we should not have a law because people continue to break it. That is just pathetic defeatism and a licence for the criminals to do as they want without even the possibility of any sanction. With the law however there is the ability to confiscate as a minimum when they do find one that is illegally held. Let's just defund the Police completely shall we?

As to the surrender of guns, I surrendered mine 'cos they are bloody useless things really and I never used it. I appreciate it is a much bigger sport in England, but the issues clearly exist there as well. It is up to them where to draw the line. Licencing did not fall apart up here when air rifles went on ticket but we don't seem to have all the problems that exist in that department south of the border.

 

[Triggermortis]

Is the application and grant process for an AWC in Scotland the same as a sec 1 or 2 or is it like buying a fishing licence, pay your money and it’s yours?

 

[Sealgair nam fiadh]

You have to give a good reason such as shooting grey squirrels in your garden or other land you have permission for or target shooting at a club.

 

[Franchi Matt]

In 2040 peas shooters and catapults will also need a licence at this rate honestly- have they any idea on figures of just how many air rifles are out there? Figures got to be huge.

 

[Mick9abf]

Actually that's not true.

Numbers below are ballpark and from my recollections of data I got a couple of years back from a Freedom of Information request. So if they are not exact don't crucify me. The gist is correct though.

If you look at the statistics that are reported for "firearms crime" over 50% of them relate to air 'weapons'. That always gets my goat because they are not bloody firearms. Of the 50% that are actually firearms/shotguns 80% of the offences relate to pistols.

So actually there is a strong argument for having them on a ticket given the incidence of 'crimes', and that was without being in possession without a ticket being a crime.

It is illogical to argue that we should not have a law because people continue to break it. That is just pathetic defeatism and a licence for the criminals to do as they want without even the possibility of any sanction. With the law however there is the ability to confiscate as a minimum when they do find one that is illegally held. Let's just defund the Police completely shall we?

As to the surrender of guns, I surrendered mine 'cos they are bloody useless things really and I never used it. I appreciate it is a much bigger sport in England, but the issues clearly exist there as well. It is up to them where to draw the line. Licencing did not fall apart up here when air rifles went on ticket but we don't seem to have all the problems that exist in that department south of the border.

In relation to air weapons not being Firearms, in the eyes of the law in some instances, for example when it comes to ‘prohibited persons’, they are classed as such.

While having a licensing system in place is not necessarily a bad idea, if you take the administrative burden and cost to Police Scotland for doing so and the delays it causes FAC holders in grants, variations etc then, yes to that point it isn’t a bad idea.

The issue you have is there is an unknown amount of air weapons in circulation and, in reality, the amount of ‘firearms offences’ committed, as in those not linked to serious and/or organised crime, involving air weapons or indeed any other firearm are fairly low or negligible.

The real issue is that the existing legislation is, and was in place to sufficiently cover all the offences that were committed pre licensing (in Scotland) but even when applied correctly wouldn’t necessarily get a conviction for a number of reasons.

There are also cases which have been in the press (feel free to look), where the firearms element of a crime, where a statutory 5 year tariff exists for the likes of possessing a firearm illegally, have not been applied and a lesser sentence for that part given but that sits with the CPS/COPFS and courts.

I didn’t see anyone saying to defund the Police which would be ridiculous, although with previous and forthcoming cuts in Scotland by the Scottish Government to both Police and the COPFS/Court budgets, there are significant fiscal challenges for them which will effect crime levels and law abiding shooters trying to navigate through the licensing system and any cuts south of the border will do similar.

To put it into perspective I would take a bet with you that there are significantly more people driving cars daily without a licence or insurance than have air weapons without a certificate in your nearest town or city.

 

[Webley]

In 2040 peas shooters and catapults will also need a licence at this rate honestly- have they any idea on figures of just how many air rifles are out there? Figures got to be huge.

You obviously missed the offensive weapon bill? Blow pipes were banned in the UK. Aka pea shooters.

As for airgun licensing south of the Scottish border. It will not happen, the Scottish experiment has killed any possibility of it. The cost and lack of impact on crime involving airguns means the police don't want it.

 

[Franchi Matt]

You obviously missed the offensive weapon bill? Blow pipes were banned in the UK. Aka pea shooters.

As for airgun licensing south of the Scottish border. It will not happen, the Scottish experiment has killed any possibility of it. The cost and lack of impact on crime involving airguns means the police don't want it.

Who does want it then?

 

[Len the dog]

Who does want it then?

Those that wish to see the end of private gun ownership, take out the next generation by putting up barriers to getting started and your task becomes so much easier.
The problems that currently exist in the licensing system that we see throughout the UK are not necessarily by chance, Chief Constables set their own budgets and if underfunding the FLD means that more gun owners will simply give up, they have succeeded in reducing the number of guns in circulation.
It doesn’t matter that the huge majority of gun crime involves illegally sourced firearms, the general public is misguided enough to not understand the difference.

 

[ContinShots]

Is the application and grant process for an AWC in Scotland the same as a sec 1 or 2 or is it like buying a fishing licence, pay your money and it’s yours?

The process is like the SGC process, albeit not quite so strict in most cases, but you have to have good reason as well, which is akin to FAC. But good reason can include just collecting and you don't need to prove the same high bona fide levels like you do for FAC. There have been cases of some FEO essentially treating it precisely like SGC but with a good reason component, while others have been closer to the 'disclosure check' promise made by the Scottish Government when passing the legislation.

 

[ContinShots]

You obviously missed the offensive weapon bill? Blow pipes were banned in the UK. Aka pea shooters.

As for airgun licensing south of the Scottish border. It will not happen, the Scottish experiment has killed any possibility of it. The cost and lack of impact on crime involving airguns means the police don't want it.

That's a myth. Official data shows quite clearly that air weapon crime has dropped in Scotland since licensing came in. That's not to say that it doesn't still exist, it does, but it's reduced and much that does occur is also down to airsoft guns, not air weapons. The debate is not about whether it's had a reduction impact on air weapons crime - it demonstrably has done - it's whether that crime was significant enough an issue to justify and warrant the large sums of money and resource spent on introducing the system and thereafter managing it year on year. Many would argue that it's not been money well spent, but claims that air weapon crime hasn't reduced is simply not true and not born out by the data. Anyhow, once they introduce crossbow licensing into England, which I'd say is more likely than not to now happen under Labour, it'll be a doddle for them to add air weapons to it. I wouldn't be aduorised at all of in five years time or thereby, crossbows and air weapons aren't under the same license in England & Wales.

 

[Jon P]

Reason for asking - my mate has just thrown in the towel as near as dammit on his sec 1 and 2 FAC’s and will only be keeping his PCP air rifle as he’s got the right arse over the paraphernalia of renewing co terminusly

In relation to renewing FAC , would it be possible for a company to start up and once you supply this company with all the relevant information, they do the rest on applying on line for you , which is the hardest part for a lot of people as you can get timed out quite quickly if you are not fast enough.

There are agents out there who record cattle moves and births / deaths of cattle on CTS for non IT using farmers.

 

[Foxyboy43]

In relation to renewing FAC , would it be possible for a company to start up and once you supply this company with all the relevant information, they do the rest on applying on line for you , which is the hardest part for a lot of people as you can get timed out quite quickly if you are not fast enough.

There are agents out there who record cattle moves and births / deaths of cattle on CTS for non IT using farmers.

So utterly useless and complex is the on-line licensing system in NI that most RFDs provide this service already - though some do charge of course….

 

[Steve Q]

Given recent events it is more likely that air rifle licencing will be delayed in favour of licencing cross bows / compound bows / long bows.
Problem is, the Labour government will expect either current FLD budgets to cover the additional work, or for fees on firearms to increase to cover the costs.

Come back Rishi, all is forgiven......

 

[ContinShots]

Given recent events it is more likely that air rifle licencing will be delayed in favour of licencing cross bows / compound bows / long bows.
Problem is, the Labour government will expect either current FLD budgets to cover the additional work, or for fees on firearms to increase to cover the costs.

Come back Rishi, all is forgiven......

They'll definitely increase fees, that's a given, but they've promised to use all of the extra money raised to pay for crime reduction initiatives in London and Birmingham. Because, you know, licensed Firearms owners in the UK are responsible for all of the inner city violence, drugs gangs and gun crime...not. They prove time after time that they are either morally corrupt and know full well that they're blaming a section of society who are the most law abiding and have nothing to do with those issues, or they are so clueless and ignorant that they genuinely think there's a direct link between lawful gun ownership and inner city gun crime (which there demonstrably is not).