What is the best scope

[jamross65]

I have spoken to a couple of folk I know in the business of optics/rifles and they have both commented on how impressed they were with the new Zeiss HT scope...

They have no allegiance to any make and have a choice of any scope they want to use themselves...

 

[wraith]

wraith this is my next scope for the 300 win with a lifetime guarantee and the great writeups witha very reasonable price tag its a must try ,atb wayne

they are worth the money bud use mine on my 7mm rem mag with very good results the mill dot is a little big but if you want it for hunting short or long rainge out to 1000yards its hard to beat they do another ret for target shooting but costs another 100pounds got mine of flee bay 400bills no regrets i would not sell it think that says it all

 

[mereside]

sorry for the highjack, thanks wraith, do you have the name of the seller off fleabay , the cheapest i found was 555 pounds which is still great value . I need two scopes and was going to go with them not many offer a lifetime guarantee , atb wayne

 

[wraith]

wraith this is my next scope for the 300 win with a lifetime guarantee and the great writeups witha very reasonable price tag its a must try ,atb wayne

use mine on a rem 700 7mm rem mag good at all rainges the mill dot ret is a little big if you were looking for a target scope but for hunting its just right total repeatabilitey triyed to get the better of mine the scope always returned to exact zero every thing does what its suposed to do cant fault it. had most of the big names s/b night force etc i personaly prefer the s111 over all of them rather have the extra money to purchase a custom barrel than a 3 grand scope that cant compeate with the sightron

 

[John Gryphon]

I have posted this previously



Swedish magazine Vapentidningen no 6/2004 has printed a consumer lab test for riflescopes suitable for hunting at dusk/dawn.
Their conclusion is that the German/Austrian scopes are by far the best, but the leap from the cheaper US scopes are smaller today than it was at the last test 7 years ago.
Aerotech Telub lab did the scientific testing using spektrofotometers, broad spectral lamps and kolliminators.

The scopes were tested for field of sight, eye relief, "tube effect", ergonomy, click adjustment accuracy, impact change with change of magnification, sharpness and contrast, light transmission, reflexes, twilight performance.
Here's a bit more on the test. unfortunately the scope selection was somewhat limited. And please not that the test was geared towards scopes for post hunting in dark autumn evenings.
The test and description of the test criterias runs over 10 typed pages, so there’s a bit too much work to translate all of that and post them on this forum However, I will post the scoring scales.


Field of view at 100m
0-5m 0 points
5-6m 1 point
6-7m 2 points
7m+ 3 points

Eye relief
0-6cm 0 points
6-8cm 1 point
8-10 2 points
10+ 3 points

Tube effect
Sight picture severly disturbed by tube effect at all magnifications: 0 points
Sight picture severly disturbed at lowest magnification, disturbed at highest: 1 point
Sight picture distusturbed at all magnifications: 2 points
Sight picture disturbed only at lowest magnification: 3 points
Sight picture not disturbed: 4 points

Ergonomy
Magnification ring turns smooth and even: 1 point
Possible to read magnification marking in the dark: 1 point
Quick and smooth focusing: 1 point
Possible to click scope without tools: 1 point
Click adjustment easy to feel: 1 point
Good markings on all adjustments: 1 point
Indication of scope center: 1 point

Sight adjustment
Click adjustment deviation in percent
100-50% 0 points
50-20% 1 point
20-5% 2 points
5-1% 3 points
0% 4 points

Adjustment range at 100m
0-50cm 0 points
50-100cm 1 point
100-200cm 2 points
200-300cm 3 points
300cm+ 4 points

Change of impact with magnification at 100m
5cm+ 0 points
5-1cm 1 point
1cm- 2points
Nil 3points

Resolution and contrast
Field testing, can/cannot see various targets, details and colours under equal conditions and settings
Resolution 0-10 points
Contrast 0-10 points

Anti reflex
Under equal conditions and settings with light source facing the objective

Lenses
Not able to see through scope: 0 points
Sight picture is white, difficult to aim: 1 point
Sight picture is white, but aiming possible: 2 points
Sight picture a little white: 3 points
Sight picture good, but without contrast or colour: 4 points
Sight picture not affected: 5 points

Reticule
Not able to use the reticule: 0 points
Severe shadows and reflexes on it: 1 point
Shadows and reflexes on it: 2 points
A little shiny: 3 points
Sharp but mis-coloured: 4 points
Sharp and black: 5 points

Light transmission at 500-550 nm (twilight light)
Please note that scopes can transmit other wavelengt light better

0-10% 0 points
10-30% 1 point
30-40% 2 points
40-50% 3 points
50-60% 4 points
60-70% 5 points
70-80% 6 points
80-85% 7 points
85-90% 8 points
90-95% 9 points
95-100% 10 points

Twilight performance
Light were progressively reduced and scopes where excluded when it was no longer possible to determine target/crosshairs. Lighted reticules were not used. Scopes where used at all magnifications. Scopes where scored 0 to 10 points according to how little light it was possible to use it in.

Scopes tested:
BSA big cat 3,5-10x42
Burris fullfield II 3,5-10x50
Bushnell elite 4200 2,5-10x40
Docter 3-12x56
Kahles cb 3-12x56
Leupold XIII 3.5-10x50
Meopta artemis 2000 3-12x50
Meopta artemis 3000 3-12x56
Micro Dot 2.5-10x56
Nickel gerhardt 3-12x56
Nightforce np1 3.5-15x56
OXO ontario 3-9x56
Pecar 4-10x56
S&B Zenith 2.5-10x56
S&B 2.5-10x56
Shirstone Gold 4-12x58
Shirstone Gold 3-10x56
Swarovski Habict 2.5-10x56
Tasco Titan 3-12x52
Trijicon accupoint 2.5-10x56
Zeiss diavari z 3-12x56
Zeiss varipoint v 3-12x56
Zeiss diavari v 3-12x56
A short summary of the results below.

Scope name
B resolution (max 10)
C colour & contrast (max 10)
D anti-reflex (max 5+5)
E light transmission (max 10)
F twilight performance (max 10)
G overall test result (including all test results, not just the ones I've printed. Max possible 7Cool

Remember, this is a lab test, not some testers subjective opinion.

BSA Big cat 3,5-10x: B3 C3 D5 E6 F3 G44
BURRIS FULLFIELD II 3,5-10X: B10 C7 D6 E9 F7 G58
DOCTER 3-12X: B7 C8 D8 E8 F7 G60
KAHLES CB 3-12: B6 C8 D8 E9 F8 G62
LEUPOLD VXIII 3,5-10X:B7 C7 D8 E8 F6 G60
MEOPTA ARTEMIS 3000 3-12X: B7 C7 D7 E7 F7 G57
MEOPTA ARTEMIS 2000 3-12X: B6 C7 D7 E7 F6 G55
MICRO DOT 2,3-10X: B7 C6 D7 E8 F7 G58
NICKEL GERHARDT 3-12X: B9 C8 D8 E9 F9 G66
NIGHTFORCE NP1 3,5-15X: B9 C6 D9 E8 F7 G60
OXO ONTARIO 3-9X: B3 C3 D4 E6 F2 G39
PECAR 4-10X: B5 C6 D6 E8 F5 G46
SCHMIDT UND BENDER ZENITH 2,5-10X: B7 C8 D9 E9 F9 G65
SCHMIDT UND BENDER 2,5-10X: B9 C8 D8 E9 F9 G66
SHIRSTONE GOLD 4-12X: B5 C5 D5 E7 F5 G47
SWAROVSKI HABICT 3-12X: B9 C9 D8 E9 F10 G68
TASCO TITAN 3-12X: B5 C6 D6 E7 F4 G49
TRIJICON ACCUPOINT 2,5-10X: B8 C6 D8 E9 F8 G64
ZEISS DIAVARI Z T 3-12X: B10 C10 D10 E9 F10 G72
ZEISS VARIPOINT V 3-12X: B9 C10 D10 E9 F9 G70
ZEISS DIAVARI V 3-12X: B10 C10 D10 E9 F10 G73

 

[ejg]

About a year ago I would have said the most advanced scope would be the Leica Magnus. A friend of mine was
involved in the developement. Huge ammount of effort with possibly the best optical team "bought" together were involved.
Time moves on and new scopes are in the making again. Hearing positive results on prototype scopes from Zeiss & Kahles being tested.
edi

 

[jamross65]

About a year ago I would have said the most advanced scope would be the Leica Magnus. A friend of mine was
involved in the developement. Huge ammount of effort with possibly the best optical team "bought" together were involved.
Time moves on and new scopes are in the making again. Hearing positive results on prototype scopes from Zeiss & Kahles being tested.
edi

Edi

You posted pictures of the new Kahles 624i a few months ago and I was really interested in it at the time, primarily because of the features it offered and claims of low light performance. Now you have used it for a while how would you rate it as a do-it-all scope for a custom built stalking rifle?

(sorry if this is hi-jacking the thread awee bit, but it is about a scope still...)

 

[ejg]

Jamross,
I sold that rifle in the meantime, kept the scope and will build myself an experimental ultra light tactical rifle.
Of course the 624i will go on again. Plan is to use this rifle for stalking and a bit of target shooting.
Generally the 624i with 34mm rings is weight wise somewhat over the top. Just too much scope for normal stalking.
Weight is around 1200 grams with mounts which is not too much for a tactical, my S&B Zenith is almost 1000grams with mounts.
Except for the weight there is nothing negativ about the 624i. I shot two deer off-hand and several at last light with my old tactical rifle.
At 6 magnification the Kahles is way better than the S&B 5-25, no tunnel view.
My friend is just testing a new Zeiss tactical which has around 3-26 magnification and might also be interesting, not sure when it will
be on the market though.
edi

 

[Sussexphill]

Thanks as usual to everyone who replied, having taken advice from those who have put in an opinion I've ordered my new scope.

My trusty current scope has served me well for many years I guess you grow old together but as my eye sight fades I need something that will help out. My current s&b can continue life on one of the other rifles.

Anyway as this thread comes to a close I the outcome is gen 2 Swarovski Z6i 2.5-15x56 P with bt.

The wife is a big fan of swarovski so let her keep her jewellery in the box.

 

[blunderbust]

Thanks as usual to everyone who replied, having taken advice from those who have put in an opinion I've ordered my new scope.

My trusty current scope has served me well for many years I guess you grow old together but as my eye sight fades I need something that will help out. My current s&b can continue life on one of the other rifles.

Anyway as this thread comes to a close I the outcome is gen 2 Swarovski Z6i 2.5-15x56 P with bt.

The wife is a big fan of swarovski so let her keep her jewellery in the box.

Great choice, I have one on my 300win mag and it is a cracking bit of kit.

 

[Tuck]

Great thread depends what the scope is going to be used for!! Long range target work got to be a s&b pm2, ziess also very good! For stalking and general point and shoot you'd be hard pressed to beat the swarovski range had a z4i on my stalking rifle best scope i'v ever had wish I had never sold it, but also you must remember price, fir the money you can't go far wrong with zeiss duralyt brilliant point and shoot scope for around the £600 mark

Rob

 

[John Gryphon]

About a year ago I would have said the most advanced scope would be the Leica Magnus. A friend of mine was
involved in the developement. Huge ammount of effort with possibly the best optical team "bought" together were involved.
Time moves on and new scopes are in the making again. Hearing positive results on prototype scopes from Zeiss & Kahles being tested.
edi

Re the Leica scopes I was told that they were made for Leica by Leupold...I cannot be 100%,maybe someone else can shed some info on this.

 

[ejg]

Re the Leica scopes I was told that they were made for Leica by Leupold...I cannot be 100%,maybe someone else can shed some info on this.

That might have been with the first attempt of scopes made, years ago. The Magnus range certainly not.
Huge money was thrown in and the best people in the the field formed a team to develope the Magnus.
edi

 

[Sussexphill]

I like the new scope and it works

Well as an update, the scope arrived a bit late but it arrived, and fitting it and a walk up to the land where I know its safe to set it up, long field with a big dip, my father walked with a tape measure to a large tree and placed a clip board with a 1 inch black dot at 75 yds, first shot didnt even hit the paper so either the tree moves or me, I walked forward to 50 yds and put a shot low, raising the site a few clicks the second shot hit just below the target, as I walked back to the 100yd mark a few more clicks and it soon was in the black making it spot on took a few more shots. Then he walked back a further 100 yds and I tested it and it was low again as you would expect so setting up the BT was fairly simple but to be honest there was not much of a drop at 200yds, then he walked back to 300 yds and same again after 3 shots it was all in the black. back to 100yds to check and away we went.

Tuesday morning I thought its time to do some culling, so at 5.30am I was laying in a place well used by me on many occasions with no gun to see what they do and i had cut a path in bracken to allow me to watch them cross, then as light broke and I was desperate for a wee, the first site of the quarry appeared, i watched as they came one by one crossing my path checking them out, there was about 25/30 fallow inc young ones and I know I had to make a dent in the population as the farmer is trusting me to do this. I saw a big stag and though he would be a good start, as I watched him smash the trees with his antlers unaware to me one of the first ones that had made their way right handed some 30 mins before had come round behind me, he was aware of me but could not see me which made me make my mind up that I did not have long before i was rumbled and would lose them, the stag will wait for another day and clocked a couple of nice size does, and as the crack went off closely followed by a thud, i knew I had had the first kill (of the day not season) I could see the doe laying down, as I stood up using the tree as a rest there was a group standing to my right looking around, at about 75 yds, I took a head shot and quickly moved the gun left as there was a group there and dropped another male and they ran off stopping in the field below, looking and putting the cross of my new expensive scope on the side of a head a nice buck I raised the BT to the 200 yds mark and fired and he dropped, they then ran towards me so keeping still I followed them until they all stopped and picked one out and dropped that one. To my relief my bladder remided me it was still there. I walked out to the field below where i took the head shot and as I walked I paced it out and at 240 yds I came across a large buck he had a clear hole through the top of his head. as I was thinking what a shot and I like this scope I thought to myself how the feck am i gonna get him back 240 yds to where I shot him and then another 300 to the jeep, I never gut on site its messy and i think it can have impact on future deer. I do carry a rope and like a pack horse I dragged him back, placing them together i thought I would bring the jeep to them as I knew it was wet but its was a bank so I woukld be ok.

anyway I like the scope the old S&B that was on the rifle has served me well and has a new lease of life on another rifle. but a big thank you to those who helped me make up my mind and go for the Z6i it was a good choice

 

[swarovski]

Go on to search and type in rifle scope myths,it's a good read and makes a lot of sense

 

[Cascade]

I love my Z6i 5-30 x 50 BT HD, It does exactly what it says on the tin.

I`ve had it since they came on the market, expensive Yes, but, the older I get the more help I need !

Bob