FAC APPLICATION HELP?

[Basil H]

You can not shoot wildfowl with an FAC shotgun. The WCA also precludes their use elsewhere - such as making it illegal to shoot a hedgehog with one !
I really think the OP needs to do a bit more homework. I imagine requesting a Sec 1 shotgun for anything other than Practical on an initial application would be tricky as usually it takes a landowner's letter to an existing SGC holder doing pest control for such a grant to succeed. Frankly having grown up in the days of 5-shot repeaters I just would not use anything of higher capacity for quarry shooting. I think you would have to have "game" listed on your certificate to use a Sec !. I just checked in the excellent book "Fair Game" but it's vague on this point.

 

[25 Sharps]

Ive looked , but can see nothing specifically 'illegal' with taking pheasants with a sec 1 shotgun ?

Again , thats down to the shoot , Ive seen plenty of game shooters using semis ?

Will have to check later but think its in The Wildlife and Countryside Act.

And yes it is down to the shoot but the vast majority, other than very small syndicates, will either not allow it or not invite you back

 

[Rewulf]

Will have to check later but think its in The Wildlife and Countryside Act.

The only bit I can find , and its in quotes from other forums , is that its illegal to shoot game with a self loading shotgun thats capable of firing more than 3 shots in succession (ie sec 1)

The wildfowl part is quite clear , no sec 1 guns, although 'technically' if its rendered incapable of firing more than 3 .... A bit of a grey area though ?

 

[25 Sharps]

You can not shoot wildfowl with an FAC shotgun. The WCA also precludes their use elsewhere - such as making it illegal to shoot a hedgehog with one !
I really think the OP needs to do a bit more homework. I imagine requesting a Sec 1 shotgun for anything other than Practical on an initial application would be tricky as usually it takes a landowner's letter to an existing SGC holder doing pest control for such a grant to succeed. Frankly having grown up in the days of 5-shot repeaters I just would not use anything of higher capacity for quarry shooting. I think you would have to have "game" listed on your certificate to use a Sec !. I just checked in the excellent book "Fair Game" but it's vague on this point.

Have a search in here, you can shoot Canada geese with an S1 if you are shooting under general licence, it specifically says so on the wording of the licence!

 

[andyk]

It’s the WAC. It actually just says ‘any semi automatic’ but reading around says that is interpreted to mean anything that cannot hold more than 2 cartridges in a magazine.

The million dollar question would be whether a magazine limiter would suffice as the magazine cannot hold more than that so long as the limiter is fitted.

I can see that being arguable but any sensible person would just use a s2 and not worry about having to convince a judge of that interpretation.

 

[25 Sharps]

The only bit I can find , and its in quotes from other forums , is that its illegal to shoot game with a self loading shotgun thats capable of firing more than 3 shots in succession (ie sec 1)

The wildfowl part is quite clear , no sec 1 guns, although 'technically' if its rendered incapable of firing more than 3 .... A bit of a grey area though ?

BASC fact sheet states any wild bird with a semi is prohibited unless shot under a general licence

Quarry species and shooting seasons

Find out everything you need to know about what you can legally shoot and when.

basc.org.uk

 

[Husky]

There was an episode of Only Fools And Horses where Del boy turned up at a pheasant shoot with a 8 shot pump action

 

[VSS]

The only bit I can find , and its in quotes from other forums , is that its illegal to shoot game with a self loading shotgun thats capable of firing more than 3 shots in succession (ie sec 1)

The wildfowl part is quite clear , no sec 1 guns, although 'technically' if its rendered incapable of firing more than 3 .... A bit of a grey area though ?

Having just done a bit of research myself in the last 20 minutes, it seems that it's only auto- and semi-auto sec.1 shotguns that are prohibited for wildfowl and gamebirds. But a sec.1 pump action would be fine. Mossberg manufacture one that is 8+1. That would raise a few eyebrows on a driven day, but hey! Why not? Nearly as bad as deerstalking with stainless and synthetic

 

[andyk]

There has to be more to that than BASC suggests as their own magazine regularly features people wildfowling with semis.

I agree that is the wording of the Act but somewhere there has to be an interpretation which has defined semi automatic as something which can hold more than 2 shots. Either that or many, many wildfowlers are committing offences.

 

[VSS]

There has to be more to that than BASC suggests as their own magazine regularly features people wildfowling with semis.

I agree that is the wording of the Act but somewhere there has to be an interpretation which has defined semi automatic as something which can hold more than 2 shots. Either that or many, many wildfowlers are committing offences.

Presumably it depends on whether that semi is sec 1 or sec 2? Presumably there are sec 2 semis that hold only 2+1 which would be perfectly legal for wildfowling?

 

[andyk]

@VSS I had wondered that but t he WCA was passed before there was a distinction between s1 and s2 shotguns and it simply says “any automatic or semi-automatic”.

I can only think that either it was tested at some point and decided that something that doesn’t have a bigger magazine than a double gun has barrels is to be considered equivalent or it has just gone on for so long that the police accept that as the unwritten interpretation.

I’m happy to be corrected though by someone with a proper answer!

 

[Stalker62]

There was an episode of Only Fools And Horses where Del boy turned up at a pheasant shoot with a 8 shot pump action

 

[TH4]

Quantities of center fire ammunition should be specified to maximum to be held, And amount to be purchased to not exceed that amount.
Shot certificate for, over and under.
Firearms certificate for Practical shot gun and ammunition if slug.
Coterminous Certificates would save you cash and time.

BC.

It is now only quantity allowed to be held or possessed they did away with the maximum amount to be purchased a while ago.

 

[Fabnosh]

I've just completed my renewal form on line (Avon and Somerset) and it only requires total ammunition holding per calibre and nothing relating to any single purchase (which was a section the form always used to carry). To your question on quantity, I usually put 1500 for .22lr and 500 for everything else.

FN

 

[DamaDama.243]

No real reason why it couldnt , depends on the rules of the shoot.
Most clay grounds allow them too , as long as you only load 2 carts.

Quarry species and shooting seasons

Find out everything you need to know about what you can legally shoot and when.

basc.org.uk

Includes this :

All wild birds

It is illegal to use:

• Any automatic or semi-automatic weapon against any bird except the Bird Pest Species listed on the general licences (see note below)

So you can not use any semi auto on pheasant.

 

[Dalua]

I’m happy to be corrected though by someone with a proper answer!

So would I - there's clearly more (or less) to it than I thought I remembered.

 

[VSS]

All wild birds

It is illegal to use:

• Any automatic or semi-automatic weapon against any bird except the Bird Pest Species listed on the general licences (see note below)

So you can not use any semi auto on pheasant.

But a pump-action section 1 would be fine?

 

[308tikka]

This is not an acceptable reason for any ammunition.

Says who?

Not my FEO. How much does the person use in a year? Perfectly acceptable to buy components of say 1000, then make a single batch, after testing of course.

 

[Dalua]

BASC in Shotgun Safety Code of Practice - The British Association for Shooting and Conservation says

It is an offence to shoot wildfowl or game with a self-loading shotgun having a magazine capacity of more than two cartridges.

Which is what I remembered, though I mistakenly included pump-action repeaters along with self-loaders.

 

[mealiejimmy]

Says who?

Not my FEO. How much does the person use in a year? Perfectly acceptable to buy components of say 1000, then make a single batch, after testing of course.

Section 13.54 of The Home Office Guide on Firearms Licensing Law states that for ammunition (as opposed to components) "Economy of purchase (‘bulk buying’) is not considered satisfactory as “good reason”.

Cheers

Bruce