@Foxyboy43 I believe that you are correct in your thinking in your example, certainly in my experience with my FAC. My understanding is that the FAC provides granted permission to acquire, and use the items written onto it according to the conditions set. The way this works on my FAC (West Yorkshire) is that the firearms (including moderators) are conditioned for use on MOD approved ranges and over land for which I have permission to shoot. On my cert the rifles and moderators were granted by calibre as I requested them in pairs. In practice I use my 6.5 mod on my .223 because it fits and works well enough.
FAQ: Do I have an Open or Closed Certificate?
- Thread starter csl
- Start date
Foxyboy43
Well-Known Member
Aye but IMHO it does seem overly bureaucratic especially when seen against the fact that the mods are not identified by make or number. A non-sense (or nonsense) example is if you had lets say two T8s for 223 and 308 - technically if you put the 308 one on the 223 you may be in breach of your condition (wouldn't recommend the other way round!) But how would it be determined other than by the size of exit hole? Just sounds totally daft to me. Just wondering what the point is indeed what is wrong in any sense other than on your fac in using a mod on a rifle which does not include said mod on said fac?
Yes, I completely agree. The whole issue of mods on FACs is a mess and the FLOs I've chatted with all agree. If I put my 6.5mm mod on my .223 all I'm doing is using two items from my FAC in accordance with the conditions. I've still got the capacity to acquire a .223 mod but nowhere is it conditioned that the 6.5 mod is for sole use on my 6.5 cal rifle. I wouldn't put it on my .308 though 
Foxyboy43
Well-Known Member
Wot a palaver, I just do not get it. Maybe you could take the lead in discussions with your licensing people????Yes, I completely agree. The whole issue of mods on FACs is a mess and the FLOs I've chatted with all agree. If I put my 6.5mm mod on my .223 all I'm doing is using two items from my FAC in accordance with the conditions. I've still got the capacity to acquire a .223 mod but nowhere is it conditioned that the 6.5 mod is for sole use on my 6.5 cal rifle. I wouldn't put it on my .308 though
Sonicdmb73
Well-Known Member
Depends on the wording of your conditions.This prompts a question or two from me having noted from this thread that as is the case in NI, unidentified (no name and no serial number) moderators are mentioned and linked to respective firearms but I do not understand the point of this. For example if I had a 308 and a 30:06 but my fac specified a moderator only for the 308 does that really mean I am not permitted to use it on the 30:06 or indeed any other rifle not so specified? If so, as certainly appears to be the case, what is the thinking behind this, to me, pointless restriction?
Mine says the rifles and moderators this certificate relates shall be used for fox deer and ALQ. So no restriction as to which is which.
Memphis
Well-Known Member
I have a question two people shooting the same land they live 3 miles apart same police district firearms officer tells one he cannot have his .308 open on this land but a different firearms officer clears the other person for .308 and .270 on same land?
how does this work?
how does this work?
Stalker62
Well-Known Member
Different applicants.
Memphis
Well-Known Member
In what way farther son and held licence same amount of time?
Do both have "closed" certificates?
The land is either cleared for calibre or it isn't, but if it's a question of one having his certificate opened and one not, or one being granted different calibres, or...?
Memphis
Well-Known Member
Both open tickets the FO visited the first one for renewal and told him the land was not suitable for .308, but another FO from same police station visited the other 3 month later no change to land at all and this FO told him his .270 and his .308 was ok for this land and opened them both
Sounds to me as if the father has a 308 already for range use, asked for it to be conditioned for quarry shooting and nominated a piece of ground that isn't cleared for 308. Told no, which would be correct.
Meanwhile the son has a 270 and 308 already conditioned for shooting quarry, and his ticket is open, meaning he can shoot wherever he wants.
Stalker62
Well-Known Member
They are two different people - it is irrelevant that they have held a FAC/SGC for the same about of time.
Trigger260
Well-Known Member
I don't believe there is an appeal process for certificate conditions!
Memphis
Well-Known Member
But the same land just a different firearms officer?
Stalker62
Well-Known Member
This is the beauty of humanity.
One FEO may have a different view of two "identical" (Father and son) applicants and issue accordingly.
Two FEOs may take differing views on the same applicant, and likewise issue accordingly.
Memphis
Well-Known Member
No actual fact is father had .308 on closed ticket for range use only son uses same range for his .270 closed ticket, applied for variation for .308 while on closed ticket. Father renewed ticket with land he already had all was opened except for .308. Father gets son permission on the land for his renewal as son's previous permissions where only up to .17, when son comes up for renewal 2 months later the different Firearms Officer gave open ticket on his .308 for quarry. Just trying to work it out is all and I agree to 2 different people but both persons no convictions or anything that would cause a problem on a ticket only difference is the Firearms officer but they was from the same department
Memphis
Well-Known Member
both closed up to renewal
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