Precision123
Well-Known Member
"aiming off" died as a concept in WW2. I have an American Army training film from the early 1940's that teaches better.
HonestJohn
Well-Known Member
Yes - and I’d go with a Klassik (that’s not entry level btw) S&B in ether 6x42 or 7x50.
I (my opinion) think 56mm is heavy and clunky and sits too high for most rifles cheekweld leading to head positioning that (might) create tension when shot prone
Except for very small vermin, target shooting and head shots, I can’t see need for magnification over 6-7x at all.
Zero at MPBR with a good 6x42and you will potentially never take the scope off your rifle again
Precision123
Well-Known Member
Helpful website
shooterscalculator.com
ShootersCalculator.com | Point Blank Range Calculator
Calculates the maximum point blank range of a firearm cartridge fired from a rifle or handgun.
4616Oxon
Well-Known Member
Many thanks!Helpful website
ShootersCalculator.com | Point Blank Range Calculator
Calculates the maximum point blank range of a firearm cartridge fired from a rifle or handgun.
4616Oxon
Well-Known Member
Will have a look. Opinions on FFO Vs SFP?
Magnificent 7
Well-Known Member
Buy a decent make but second hand Swaro,Zeiss,Schmidt they’ll be leaps and bounds ahead of any new hawke ect
HonestJohn
Well-Known Member
If a fixed mag then it’s not relative
If variable FFP all the way for me, 2nd FP gets too big and covers the target area, so not great on a long fox or trying some targets, but useful on a deer at 250 when it’s still a bit dark and using a non-illuminated scope. Personally I walk away from such shots though
HonestJohn
Well-Known Member
Understanding and Using MPBR (Maximum Point Blank Range) — Ron Spomer Outdoors
Zeroing a rifle for maximum point blank range can keep you on targets for perfect hits out to 300, perhaps even 400 yards without the need for ranging precisely, dialing turrets, or choosing sub-reticles.
www.ronspomeroutdoors.com
because your shooting at a target of 4" or greater, depending on what your shooting you are going to be lets say 1" high within that 4" circle . You do need good glass because when shooting woodland the first hour of light and the last hour is when you will shoot most deer , on the open hill its different but then its ATVs bumping around trying to knock your zero out .
I wouln't put a Hawke on anything other than an airgun personally speaking . Good scopes perform even when bought second hand and actually hold their money pretty well ( if only money itself held its value eh)?
norcan
Well-Known Member
Wait… are you saying the reticle on a second-focal-plane optic covers too much at high magnification, or did you mean the other way around?
HonestJohn
Well-Known Member
norcan
Well-Known Member
Ha, no worries. Figured as much since it was obvious from the context; just wanted to clarify for the benefit of the OP. I completely agree with you about preferring SFP for a stalking rifle, by the way.yes, always do that FFS!,
yes, 2nd FP scopes remain constant and 1st increase relative to zoom, potentially covering small targets...
thanks for pointing out
Erik Hamburger
Well-Known Member
In my experience, the less bells and whistles, the better. Nothing to distract you, and shooting becomes quick and instinctive. No need for a calculator, App, or too much thinking. A simply crosshair or Duplex reticule will do just fine, 'holding over' is rarely if never required at normal shooting distances of typically 50-150 Yards.
Have a look at the Meopta range of scopes, there are still some excellent 7x50 fixed power 'Artemis' examples available (but new production is discontinued) and they will be just fine for most deer stalking scenario's.
Have a look at the Meopta range of scopes, there are still some excellent 7x50 fixed power 'Artemis' examples available (but new production is discontinued) and they will be just fine for most deer stalking scenario's.
HonestJohn
Well-Known Member
USED SWAROVSKI HABICHT 6X42
thehunterscabin.com
Koenig
Well-Known Member
Agreed. You can over complicate this. For most UK stalking scenarios (excluding the Highlands) you will be shooting up to about 150m - maybe 200m in extremis. If you zero dead in at 100m or even 1” above as some prefer you’re going to be on for practical purposes. I lift my shot slightly for anything over 150m but I know my POA/POI. In my opinion you absolutely do not want to be arseing about unscrewing turret caps/clicking up/down/sideways etc. You want to point and press before the deer senses something is up and clears off. For this a fixed 6x42 upwards is all you need. I use an S&B 8x56 and never found it lacking. Go with a good brand such as Swarovski/S&B/Doctor/Meopta etc.
4616Oxon
Well-Known Member
View on Kahles? Is it a good make and have a good few FFP options which I prefer from army days and other scopes. I agree not to be messing around with dialling but a couple of aim point would be useful? I would think. The option to have variable focus would make it suitable for other environments as well? This is my thinking feel free to shoot me down- no pun intended!
nun_hunter
Well-Known Member
Use what you have to start with and you'll then find what the limitations are and where you want to improve things. This will give you the best idea for what scope you need.
Some people use a fixed mag scope with plain reticle and either get closer or make do with being happy to hit anywhere within a 6" circle or do have a variable scope but "leave it on 8X all the time". They're probably the same people who leave their new TV on factory settings, or never take their car out of comfort mode regardless of the road they're on. Nothing wrong with that at all but some people enjoy using kit to the best of its designed ability and so will know that the first hash down on the reticle equates to exactly 147m and the second one to 214m, they also change from 2X mag in the woodland to 15X when they get in the highseat and know the deer are gonna be 150m away when they appear.
Going out stalking will help you realise which category you for in and so what will suit you best, then you can come back with the question of "which scope" but be able to narrow down the parameters that you want.
It took me a few years and many deer (many more missed opportunities) to decide what I want from each rifle and scope combo.
Some people use a fixed mag scope with plain reticle and either get closer or make do with being happy to hit anywhere within a 6" circle or do have a variable scope but "leave it on 8X all the time". They're probably the same people who leave their new TV on factory settings, or never take their car out of comfort mode regardless of the road they're on. Nothing wrong with that at all but some people enjoy using kit to the best of its designed ability and so will know that the first hash down on the reticle equates to exactly 147m and the second one to 214m, they also change from 2X mag in the woodland to 15X when they get in the highseat and know the deer are gonna be 150m away when they appear.
Going out stalking will help you realise which category you for in and so what will suit you best, then you can come back with the question of "which scope" but be able to narrow down the parameters that you want.
It took me a few years and many deer (many more missed opportunities) to decide what I want from each rifle and scope combo.
Hook'N'Bullet
Well-Known Member
Vortex Razor HD LHT
Steff
Well-Known Member
Kahles make very good scopes. But FFP only on their target models. The hunting scopes are all SFP.
Additional aim points are more of a hinderance for stalking than a help. You need to be quick and quick means intuitive action. If your rifle is sighted in an inch or an inch and a half high at 100m you don‘t need to correct anything out to 200m. Most people haven‘t shot that far once in their life and fabulate about ASV‘s BDC‘s and what not. Go out and shoot targets at 100, 200 and 300m. You will see where your impacts are and also their spread. Depending on caliblre you will be about 25 to 40 cm low at 300m. Nobody needs a ballistic reticle or dialing to correct for this on a deer. If one cannot correct for 30 cm on a deer this person shouldn‘t be shooting at live quarry at all.
Whether you go fixed or variable power, buy the best scope you can afford. German if you can. Cheap air rifle or rimfire scopes, tend not to be able to handle the recoil and abuse of a centrefire. There is nothing worse than a poor scope that doesn't keep zero or knocks your confidence. Most rifles can perform well enough to kill a deer at stalking ranges. I'd way rather have a decent scope with a worn rifle, whereas a damaged scope makes any rifle pretty much useless.
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