BASC calls for independent regulatory body for firearms licensing

[Apthorpe]

It's worth paying attention to what is actually happening.

This is from the Lincs FLD webpage:

Dishonest Medical Declarations.

This is an appeal from Firearms Licensing for all applicants to ensure that they are being truthful regarding their medical declaration. We are currently having to refuse people who have made dishonest declarations regarding their health. In many of these instances the condition identified would not of been a reason for refusal.

A dishonest declaration is a criminal offence and will result in the refusal whereas the existence of a condition may not necessarily result in a refusal.

Particular attention should be paid to the question on your application form “Have you ever been diagnosed with or treated for any of the relevant medical conditions…”

Everyone they have to refuse simply adds to the administrative burden.

Obviously making a dishonest medical declaration is a bad idea. However, it does not add to the administrative burden. It reduces it, by avoiding the need for the FEO visit, the other checks made, the processing of certificate documentation, consideration of variations and actually doing the renewal.
That's just another example of the state blaming its inefficiency on its own citizens. Let us not forget that these medical requirements were substantially complicated by the action of Lincs Police in the first place.

 

[webley701]

they have that anyway, we all used to tick a little box that gave the police access to out medical records!

If you have nothing to hide, you don’t have a problem.

As I understand it they don’t have access to the actual medical records - they access via the GP.

Having something to hide isn’t the point - privacy is.

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

As I understand it they don’t have access to the actual medical records - they access via the GP.

Having something to hide isn’t the point - privacy is.

Either or i’m not fussed they can do what they like!

 

[Spix]

Obviously making a dishonest medical declaration is a bad idea. However, it does not add to the administrative burden. It reduces it, by avoiding the need for the FEO visit, the other checks made, the processing of certificate documentation, consideration of variations and actually doing the renewal.
That's just another example of the state blaming its inefficiency on its own citizens. Let us not forget that these medical requirements were substantially complicated by the action of Lincs Police in the first place.

It is good to support the police and medical checks are certainly necessary.

It would seem unlikely that they don't visit for following up a medical declaration.

 

[Apthorpe]

It is good to support the police

Why? It's better to support good practice, challenge institutional failure and to call out failure before it results in tragedy.

and medical checks are certainly necessary.

That's highly debatable and not a statement supported by solid evidence. The recent change effectively consists of creating a bureaucratic layer whereby someone who is not qualified to form an opinion on a person's medical condition has to rule on every individual case, whereas previously the same judgement was given only when necessary by someone who was qualified. There is no evidence that this approach actually reduces risk to the public. As usual, it's a distraction from where the failure actually lies around events like the Plymouth shootings.

It would seem unlikely that they don't visit for following up a medical declaration.

It seems very likely given the content of your previous post states that they're having to refuse people on that ground alone. What would be the point of following up further when they know they cannot grant a certifcate? It makes no sense.

 

[sikamalc]

With regard to Europe places like Germany require you to be trained & qualified before you are let loose with a hunting rifle

Yes I know. But they still need to be insured.

 

[finnbear270]

With regard to Europe places like Germany require you to be trained & qualified before you are let loose with a hunting rifle

Why not require training for those who are supposed to regulate?

 

[timbrayford]

Well let them keep it that way, but not go that way here.

Indeed the last thing that we need is to be able to demonstrate beyond question that we are safe, knowledgeable and competent in shooting and wildlife management. After all it would make it much more difficult for antis and politicians like Starmer , WJ etc to have a bash at us and we wouldn't want that would we?

 

[timbrayford]

Yes I know. But they still need to be insured.

Got that condition on my FAC, what about you?

 

[timbrayford]

Why not require training for those who are supposed to regulate?

Essential!

 

[MAH]

Firearms licensing is in crisis. The 43 licensing authorities in England and Wales are unable to manage their workload, with some refusing to process grants and many taking more than a year to process renewals. A largely unprofessional, overburdened and poorly resourced

Hi Connor. That's quite a statement and whilst I can't comment on other forces, it bares no resemblance to my experience in Cheshire over the last 40 yes of holding certificates.

Have BASC published data and charts to support the statement?

I'd be interested to no how many is "many" in this statement " many taking more than a year to process renewal".

Could you post a link to the raw data?

Thanks in advance.
M

 

[spanj]

Theoretically we are already paying for the service through a variety of funding mechanisms, so in principle the money already exists to pay for it. It would bring together under one body what 43 bodies are clearly not capable of providing consistently now.

I’ve said it often enough but we should all remember it’s the public who should pay for firearms licensing as it’s for their safety . Nothing in this principle has changed since it was introduced other than police complaining about funding.

 

[Greenmist]

Even better if we had 10 year licenses.

A lifetime licence wouldn't be an issue if the police trusted the medical marker system

 

[enfieldspares]

Maybe firearms staff trained like the equivalent of DSC 1 and DSC 2? Or accredited to something like the British Game Alliance offers accreditation to shoots? Oh...now wait...and who is involved either directly or indirectly with both the DSC "system" and in seed funding the BGA? Oh, yes, it's BASC isn't it.

 

[spanj]

What makes you think the licencing depts would manage on a Grand?

Somebody will be along shortly to say £200 per year is excellent value for money

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

I’ve said it often enough but we should all remember it’s the public who should pay for firearms licensing as it’s for their safety . Nothing in this principle has changed since it was introduced other than police complaining about funding.

Thats hilarious, you want the firearm you pay for the privilege!

 

[Ratel]

Police Service or Police FORCE?

1000 percent it should be the first.

 

[sikamalc]

Got that condition on my FAC, what about you?

Nope.

 

[Ratel]

Reads a bit like BASC wishing to keep their arm in the till.

Still. One wooden top walking down the High Street yesterday afternoon with his hands in his pockets, I kid you not!

That said, typical SD whiners thread. FLD Lincs., in my humble experience, exemplary service. Always has been. Thanks chaps!

Just remember it's GS4 and was the first to demand doctors certs. Apart from that quite good.

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

Hi Connor. That's quite a statement and whilst I can't comment on other forces, it bares no resemblance to my experience in Cheshire over the last 40 yes of holding certificates.

Have BASC published data and charts to support the statement?

I'd be interested to no how many is "many" in this statement " many taking more than a year to process renewal".

Could you post a link to the raw data?

Thanks in advance.
M

The 2022 BASC report is here:

https://basc.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/dlm_uploads/2022/08/Firearms-licensing-report.pdf