The 22-284: A 5100fps wildcat

[12gsnapcaps]

Just been reading this article by UK Gunmart on the '22-284' - very interesting!

The barrel life of a mayfly but in terms of engineering, ballistics and physics - whats not to like!

Wildcatting: Warp Speed Mr Sulu

Bruce Potts might have just created the ultimate barrel-burner with his latest whacky, wildcat creation, how does 5000 fps+ sound?

www.gunmart.net

 

[mealiejimmy]

As an experiment I managed 4895fp with 35g Hornady NTX bullets in a Bergara B14 HMR 22-250 with a 1 in 9 twist barrel using 35.8g of RS52
All off the shelf products - nothing special needed and the bullets did not disintegrate or keyhole
Accuracy was excellent - way less than 1 inch at 100 yards
As I said, this was an experiment and as I have no wish to burn out the barrel any faster than a normal 22-250, I won't be using it regularly

Cheers

Bruce

 

[John Gryphon]

Ceramic barrel liners are needed to be developed for super speeds.

However I am far more impressed by the A10 Warthog shooting 30mm @ 3300 fps.

 

[HandB]

Ceramic barrel liners are needed to be developed for super speeds.

However I am far more impressed by the A10 Warthog shooting 30mm @ 3300 fps.

Yes and even some really old anti-tank weapons had amazing ballistics, especially the 17 pounder gun used in the Sherman Firefly which could shoot a 7.7lb discarding sabot projectile at 3,950 fps and make mincemeat of a Tiger tank.

 

[Ratwhiskers]

lt makes me smile sometimes, when l hear someone bleating that barrel life of this or that when it only runs to 900-1000rnds. Once load development has taken place, say 15-30rnds if proficient, then the rest all add up to one enormous pile of dead foxes!

 

[John Gryphon]

Yes and even some really old anti-tank weapons had amazing ballistics, especially the 17 pounder gun used in the Sherman Firefly which could shoot a 7.7lb discarding sabot projectile at 3,950 fps and make mincemeat of a Tiger tank.

You bet and something quick hit this, imagine the head ringing.. ouch!

 

[FreshFace]

Just been reading this article by UK Gunmart on the '22-284' - very interesting!

The barrel life of a mayfly but in terms of engineering, ballistics and physics - whats not to like!

Wildcatting: Warp Speed Mr Sulu

Bruce Potts might have just created the ultimate barrel-burner with his latest whacky, wildcat creation, how does 5000 fps+ sound?

www.gunmart.net

Many years ago, it was an itch I wanted to scratch after reading several articles and corresponding with Blaine Eddy, who was a huge advocate of it. And even went as far have the reamer made but unfortunately other projects took over and it never happened, I’ll always wonder…

The reamer went to Dave Wylde @ Valkyrie Rifle if you fancy having one built.

 

[Triggermortis]

I seem to remember many moons ago being shown a 22-270 built by the late Colin Smith, a gunsmith from Ash near Canterbury, by all accounts it was ahead of its time, on chest shooting foxes the carcass was recycled into a sort of mist, from memory (and this was probably 35yrs ago) it lasted about 400 rounds before the groups started to open up.

 

[Greenmist]

lt makes me smile sometimes, when l hear someone bleating that barrel life of this or that when it only runs to 900-1000rnds. Once load development has taken place, say 15-30rnds if proficient, then the rest all add up to one enormous pile of dead foxes!

Friend of mine had a .22-243 and was told to expect 900 round barrel life, as it was only going to be used on foxes, he was happy with that, even if he only had a 50% success rate

 

[griff]

.22 Middlestead will do 5200-5300fps with a 30gn bullet..

 

[Corvid8x57]

I seem to remember many moons ago being shown a 22-270 built by the late Colin Smith, a gunsmith from Ash near Canterbury, by all accounts it was ahead of its time, on chest shooting foxes the carcass was recycled into a sort of mist, from memory (and this was probably 35yrs ago) it lasted about 400 rounds before the groups started to open up.

I have a .243 built by Colin Smith of Ash - it started life as a .22-243 but was rebarrelled & then left to me by a friend. It is a beautiful rifle which I am nervous of scratching / dropping / getting wet.

 

[Brno2e]

I guess it's down to what rocks your boat and how deep your pockets are but I am quite happy to stick to my .222 and expect it will double the 5000 plus rounds fired before it or me expires.

 

[scotch_egg]

.22 Middlestead will do 5200-5300fps with a 30gn bullet..

The issue is the wind with the 30grn bullets. With a 10mph wind. I’ve just popped the ballistics in applied ballistics. @300m The drop is 7.1” but the wind is 27.5”

A 77grn Sierra TMK at 3000fps @300m the drop is 10.7” and wind 8.5”

Now a 53grn Hornady V-max at 4000fps @300m the drop is 5” and the wind is 9.9”

I do enjoy looking at ballistics and contemplating wha would be the most efficient combination. A re-barrel now days is running to beyond £800. Then you factor in reports that federal large primers have hit £200/1000 it gets pretty expensive this shooting lark, especially if you choose a barrel burner. But you only live one



I’m interested to see what the .22 creedmoor does. It’s got quite a following. Not sure if it’s worth it over a .22-250 though.

 

[jthyttin]

As an experiment I managed 4895fp with 35g Hornady NTX bullets in a Bergara B14 HMR 22-250 with a 1 in 9 twist barrel using 35.8g of RS52

Are you sure the chrono was picking up the correct velocity? The speed just sounds quite high.

RS doesn't list loads for light bullets, but they do list RS52 max of 37gr for 55 grain and 37.8gr for 50 grain.

Nosler lists 35gr bullets, max velocities are 4500fps +- for several powders.

 

[mealiejimmy]

The Chronograph was a magnetospeed and I have been using it for several years and have no reason to doubt it's accuracy
I also shot several different loads that day from the same rifle (50g VMax and 69g TMK) - all of which produced velocities the same or very close to the same velocities as those same loads had produced on previous outings.
I have no evidence that the chrono was faulty so I tend to believe it's results
Also, I have previously contacted RS powders for loads for a 22-250 (but not for 35g NTX) and the loads they suggest are very conservative.

They use Quickload for their recommendations and attach a print out of the various parameters on which the suggested load is based.
I also have Quickload and when I input those same parameters I get the the same loads
However - Quickload does not suggest any loads greater than 15% below theoretical Pmax and they also state that there can be up to a +/- 10% lot to lot variance in the burning rate of the powder.
Two final points:
a. The RS suggested load used the Quickload weighting factor of 0.5 which applies to "typical" bottleneck cartridges.
Quickload suggests a weighting factor of 0.33 for "overbore" cartridges and since 22-250, this is the weighting facyor I used
b. The RS suggested load used the nominal case capacity for 22-250 of 43.49 grains. I used Lapua brass with a measured case capacity of 46.0 grains of water
Both these factors reduce Pmax for a given weight of powder, or conversely, allow more powder to be used to reach some specified pressure.

Cheers

Bruce

 

[Foxyboy43]

I guess it's down to what rocks your boat and how deep your pockets are but I am quite happy to stick to my .222 and expect it will double the 5000 plus rounds fired before it or me expires.

Indeed so - 5000 ain’t even run in yet! My ol’ remmy has somewhere between 25-30,000 through it (in my time) - virtually no rifling for the first third of the barrel but still shoots well below moa and I suspect will still be doing it long after I have had a discussion on the pros and cons of shooting with Old Nick and won of course.
You gotta love the sainted triple.

 

[Muir]

Just been reading this article by UK Gunmart on the '22-284' - very interesting!

The barrel life of a mayfly but in terms of engineering, ballistics and physics - whats not to like!

Wildcatting: Warp Speed Mr Sulu

Bruce Potts might have just created the ultimate barrel-burner with his latest whacky, wildcat creation, how does 5000 fps+ sound?

www.gunmart.net

There was a gunsmith in Albuquerque, New Mexico that wild catted the 284 case in calibers from 17 to 6.5 back in the 60's and 70's and sold many rifles in these chamberings, with the 6mm-284 being the most popular. He told me that the 6.5 was a better cartridge but the limited bullet variety back then hindered it's sales. ~Muir

 

[12gsnapcaps]

Or how do we feel about the .17 Incinerator?

.17 Incinerator — Ultimate Varmint Cartridge with Mach 5 Speed « Daily Bulletin

In the world of varmint cartridges, it's all about speed. Higher velocity delivers flatter trajectories, and more dramatic impacts on critters. To achieve higher speeds, handloaders have experimented with many extreme wildcats -- big cases necked down to a smal...

bulletin.accurateshooter.com

Here we present what may be the most extreme wildcat cartridge of all, the .17 Incinerator — a .50 BMG necked down to .17 caliber. Created by Ammo-One, a custom cartridge company, the .17 Incinerator offers blistering performance. The special lathe-turned 33gr projectiles* exit the barrel at 5883 Feet Per Second — that’s over Mach 5, five times the speed of sound.

 

[12gsnapcaps]

Oh sweet Lord .... or the .17 Incinerator Improved! Capable of 6,200 fps!

 

[12gsnapcaps]

PS: The above are April Fools day posts