Stalking Show - Head Shooting discussion

[RCS Deer Management]

How on earth was that still alive? Where was the entry?

Opposite side, above spine. Iv got another picture of a roe doe that I had to track with the dog to dispatch after it had been seen by a farmer. Shot in front of one of one shoulder and exited out of the opposite shoulder blade, pretty much a hilar shot. It was completely healed up and the deer was still mobile despite being skin and bones. Turned out it had been shot 3 months prior with a .308.

 

[Sol]

I actually admit, I just jaw shot one.

Nothing particularly crazy had been standing for a few minutes watching a vixen dog and there cubs running around there den site, and I noticed too my left there was a buck peeking out maybe 50 yards away settled the crosshairs on the neck and I knew right as the shot went off It wasn't quite right.

Absolutely legged it too the shot-site and dispatched it after it stumbled a few times with another shot, sliced the throat for good measure.

Not a great situation, but at least I was aware of the reaction and acted on it swiftly.

 

[Heym SR20]

I actually admit, I just jaw shot one.

Nothing particularly crazy had been standing for a few minutes watching a vixen dog and there cubs running around there den site, and I noticed too my left there was a buck peeking out maybe 50 yards away settled the crosshairs on the neck and I knew right as the shot went off It wasn't quite right.

Absolutely legged it too the shot-site and dispatched it after it stumbled a few times with another shot, sliced the throat for good measure.

Not a great situation, but at least I was aware of the reaction and acted on it swiftly.

Been there done that. Next time stay where you are and shoot it again. Or move if you have to to get a clear shot.

Running in fast seems like the right thing to do, but mostly this will result in the deer running off to the next county. I had exactly this earlier in the year. I shot a hind a bit far back. It stumbled downhill and went down behind a rock. The well meaning young lad I was with ran after it and we then followed it a good mile along a steep mountain side. Eventually it had run out of blood pressure and collapsed under some trees.

If we had left it alone for ten minutes, it would have died in a few moments. Or we should have moved quietly so that we could observe and shot it again if needs be. Mostly body shots will bleed out in a few moments, but they can and do clot up.

Head / neck shots - will drop on the spot. If not perfect the deer will struggle back to its feet really quite quickly. Thats the time to put another shot in. And your best position is probably the one from which you took your initial shot. The animal will be quickly dispatched with minimum of fuss and stress.

Knives for dispatching antlered deer is an accident awaiting to happen. A deer in the last moments of its life is very very strong and will struggle and kick very hard. And antlers and hooves are bloody sharp.

I did once spend a day following up a jaw shot cattle eating lion, that a guest had shot the night before. We never caught up with it despite tracking it for most of a day through scrub. We heard it lots and lots of fresh blood, but never saw it. I was armed with a double 12 bore with slugs and I was on point protecting the tracker. PH to one side, client on the other. Kind of exciting.

 

[VSS]

I actually admit, I just jaw shot one.

Nothing particularly crazy had been standing for a few minutes watching a vixen dog and there cubs running around there den site, and I noticed too my left there was a buck peeking out maybe 50 yards away settled the crosshairs on the neck and I knew right as the shot went off It wasn't quite right.

Absolutely legged it too the shot-site and dispatched it after it stumbled a few times with another shot, sliced the throat for good measure.

Not a great situation, but at least I was aware of the reaction and acted on it swiftly.

Neck shots are the ones most likely to go wrong, imo. I really don't like taking neck shots. Faced with a choice between head and neck I'd always go head.

 

[HonestJohn]

I actually admit, I just jaw shot one.

Nothing particularly crazy had been standing for a few minutes watching a vixen dog and there cubs running around there den site, and I noticed too my left there was a buck peeking out maybe 50 yards away settled the crosshairs on the neck and I knew right as the shot went off It wasn't quite right.

Absolutely legged it too the shot-site and dispatched it after it stumbled a few times with another shot, sliced the throat for good measure.

Not a great situation, but at least I was aware of the reaction and acted on it swiftly.

Will you try same shot placement again?

 

[jall55]

Most of the shots with a rifle on anything that i have seen or heard about being missed or messed up tend to simply come down to people shooting too far - overestimating their skills.
I will head shoot but keep the distances down - really down

 

[VSS]

Most of the shots with a rifle on anything that i have seen or heard about being missed or messed up tend to simply come down to people shooting too far - overestimating their skills.
I will head shoot but keep the distances down - really down

I think it happens when it's the last (and only) chance that presents itself before having to call it a day and go home empty handed. That's when someone feels tempted to take a shot that’s really beyond their capabilities, exacerbated by being under the pressure of knowing it's the only chance of a shot they're going to get.

 

[HonestJohn]

I think it happens when it's the last (and only) chance that presents itself before having to call it a day and go home empty handed. That's when someone feels tempted to take a shot that’s really beyond their capabilities, exacerbated by being under the pressure of knowing it's the only chance of a shot they're going to get.

I know a guide (from this very forum) who has their client on their first time on deer (ever), take a 200m headshot on roe off sticks because it was on way back to car.. make of that what you will, but it went well thank god, - client unfortunately might think from then on ‘it’s the shot to take’

 

[Camdig]

Ive mucked up a few times with kneck/head shots, the picture below was in a plantation so I was under a little more pressure to get a result, I pulled the shot at last second, it was 24hrs later before I caught up with her again, fortunately it wasn't a jaw off.
Edit - I still take regular head and kneck shots as well as H & L.

 

[75]

I think that's a very poor attitude that shows zero respect for your quarry, quite honestly.

My respect for my quarry when in the field is to kill it as quickly as possible, in the most efficient way with the least suffering. I don't worry about carcass damage, I worry about making it quick (for the animal).

My respect for the carcass begins once it is on the ground.

 

[HonestJohn]

In terms of respect for the carcass, ok, obviously shooting a roe with a hand grenade would be disrespectful as it’s just killing with no meat value left - , but it’s a line drawing where ethical and respectful shot placement turns to disrespect for the carcass in terms of meat wastage.

To me, I personally don’t see should shots as wasted meat, if shot with non toxic all meat can be used apart from the bloodshot, which is minimal. I also boil and eat the tongue, so to me a headshot with a damaged tongue would be disrespectful

 

[VSS]

My respect for my quarry when in the field is to kill it as quickly as possible, in the most efficient way with the least suffering. I don't worry about carcass damage, I worry about making it quick (for the animal).

My respect for the carcass begins once it is on the ground.

I think it's all part and parcel of the same package.
Producing top quality venison should begin before you even squeeze the trigger, not be a salvage job once the animal is dead.

That's my opinion, anyway.
Other opinions are available.

 

[75]

I think it's all part and parcel of the same package.
Producing top quality venison should begin before you even squeeze the trigger, not be a salvage job once the animal is dead.

That's my opinion, anyway.
Other opinions are available.

It has no impact on the quality of venison; absolutely none. It only impacts the volume. I might lose a bit more but that's a commercial decision and not one of quality and suggesting it's a "salvage job" is nigh on offensive.

I could counter that your view of maximising yield is one driven by greed and nothing to do with the quality of the venison.

But that would just be my opinion.
Others are available.

 

[VSS]

It has no impact on the quality of venison; absolutely none. It only impacts the volume. I might lose a bit more but that's a commercial decision and not one of quality and suggesting it's a "salvage job" is nigh on offensive.

I could counter that your view of maximising yield is one driven by greed and nothing to do with the quality of the venison.

But that would just be my opinion.
Others are available.

Wouldn't it be a dull world if we all thought the same!

 

[Mungo]

I know a guide (from this very forum) who has their client on their first time on deer (ever), take a 200m headshot on roe off sticks because it was on way back to car.. make of that what you will, but it went well thank god, - client unfortunately might think from then on ‘it’s the shot to take’

And there are plenty of clients who decide, against all advice and even contrary to direct instructions, that they know better, and have a crack at a head shot!

I get nervous when a client arrives and starts telling me about all the amazing head shots they pull off. Roe at 400m off sticks blah blah blah.

No mate: you will be shooting them in the chest, off a bipod, at no more than 150m! Congratulations - you have just put yourself into the ‘can’t be trusted’ bucket.

 

[Taff]

I think it's all part and parcel of the same package.
Producing top quality venison should begin before you even squeeze the trigger, not be a salvage job once the animal is dead.

That's my opinion, anyway.
Other opinions are available.

If you want to produce high quality venison, farm it, I doubt if anyone can tell the difference between head shot, or pump house, the after shot is far more important for quality as you know.
Head and neck is about amount of waste.
I remember the days of John strange butchers in Lyndhurst, all damage and trimming went into sausages, queues of tourists buying the sausages

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

see below

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

I think it's all part and parcel of the same package.
Producing top quality venison should begin before you even squeeze the trigger, not be a salvage job once the animal is dead.

That's my opinion, anyway.
Other opinions are available.

No it’s not!

You head shoot because it’s ££££ nothing more nothing less!

Now that’s a poor attitude!

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

It has no impact on the quality of venison; absolutely none. It only impacts the volume. I might lose a bit more but that's a commercial decision and not one of quality and suggesting it's a "salvage job" is nigh on offensive.

I could counter that your view of maximising yield is one driven by greed and nothing to do with the quality of the venison.

But that would just be my opinion.
Others are available.

You’ve knocked the nail on the head there pounds shillings and pence that is al @VSS cares about that is very plain to see

 

[VSS]

You’ve knocked the nail on the head there pounds shillings and pence that is al @VSS cares about that is very plain to see

If that was what I cared about I'd have chosen a very different career path, believe you me.

The reason I shoot deer is that I care - passionately - about being able to produce and supply meat from animals that I have killed and butchered myself. It's been my interest since I was a child, and I believe very strongly that it's the best way of doing things, for a whole host of reasons including animal welfare. But it can never be anything other than small-scale, and it will never make much money. The only thing that really matters to me is that I'm doing something that I enjoy doing.

If I was legally allowed to kill, butcher and sell my own sheep I would probably never have started shooting deer, and I would be just as happy and equally penniless.