BASC response to proposed Scottish deer management changes

[Conor O'Gorman]

BASC has responded to a Scottish Government stakeholder consultation on proposals to implement some recommendations made by the Deer Working Group to amend the Deer (Scotland) Act 1996.

In summary:

SUPPORT - Permit the use of light intensifying, heat sensitive or other special sighting devices to shoot deer at night.
SUPPORT - Amend the minimum bullet weight so as to make non-lead ammunition more accessible.
OPPOSED - Remove close seasons for male deer (red, sika, fallow, roe).

Click weblink below for more detail.

BASC response to Scottish deer management changes

The proposals relate to the use of night shooting equipment, minimum bullet weights and the removal of the close seasons for male deer.

basc.org.uk

 

[jimmy milnes]

Membership resignation on its way tomorrow @Conor O'Gorman

Agree with number 2
and have no opinions either way with 3, but to back 1 is wrong in my opinion.
Regards
Jimmy

 

[Husky]

It's happening no matter what anyone says, don't forget the SNP/Greens have a habit of doing what they want.

 

[StephenToast]

Fair play BASC a far more pragmatic respinse than the BDS who are obviously against deer management ever stepping out of the dark ages as is Jimmy above.

I support the removal of close seasons for male deer and would like to see the removal of close seasons for female deer.

Or, the introduction of closed seasons. for foxes.

 

[NullMac]

SUPPORT - Permit the use of light intensifying, heat sensitive or other special sighting devices to shoot deer at night.

For those on the Fit & Competent register. Many of whom will be doing it already of course.

DSC2 and Best Practice Guidance needs beefed up to add demonstration of shooting competence. But that's another issue

 

[jimmy milnes]

Fair play BASC a far more pragmatic respinse than the BDS who are obviously against deer management ever stepping out of the dark ages as is Jimmy above.

I support the removal of close seasons for male deer and would like to see the removal of close seasons for female deer.

Or, the introduction of closed seasons. for foxes.

I'm not in the dark age, however you, like I, have the right to an opinion.

 

[StephenToast]

I'm not in the dark age, however you, like I, have the right to an opinion.

Indeed.
What is your opposition to the use of light intensifying scopes for night shooting?

 

[jimmy milnes]

Indeed.
What is your opposition to the use of light intensifying scopes for night shooting?

I don't think they're up to it in "ALL" situations, some yes but certainly not all yet, however the legislation if gets through will allow their use in any situation.
Maybe in time yes with advancements in tech I'll hold your opinion but right now I'm a no.
Basically it doesn't "as I'm aware" stipulate on quality of unit, so basically there's a big range between the 200 quid China thermal and something really up there with mil type grading.
Jimmy.

 

[StephenToast]

I don't think they're up to it in "ALL" situations, some yes but certainly not all yet, however the legislation if gets through will allow their use in any situation.
Maybe in time yes with advancements in tech I'll hold your opinion but right now I'm a no.
Basically it doesn't "as I'm aware" stipulate on quality of unit, so basically there's a big range between the 200 quid China thermal and something really up there with mil type grading.
Jimmy.

You could quite easily say that about standard day scopes for conventional stalking.

 

[jimmy milnes]

You could quite easily say that about standard day scopes for conventional stalking.

I suppose you could, however I personally don't think even the worst of "day" scopes gives a picture that wouldn't identify something and any potential hazard to letting a round go.
Jimmy

 

[StephenToast]

I suppose you could, however I personally don't think even the worst of "day" scopes gives a picture that wouldn't identify something and any potential hazard to letting a round go.
Jimmy

It's not the scope's responsibility to identify the hazard though. That is the responsibility of the shooter and always will be no matter whether it's daylight, or night time, with a lamp, night vision or thermal.

Unless I misunderstand the position is to allow image intensifying devices for shooting. Unless people are using their scopes to scan and locate deer, then surely the target and backstop, and it's safety would have already been idenitified by other means.

 

[David Barker]

BASC at the best support a Deer working group that was not fit for purpose. Lets look at were there finding came from. One man Andrew Barber a well know deer hater mainly of the Red deer variety. Not one of them came near the central belt of Scotland and one of them thought we had incursions of deer pouring in to the central belt of Scotland. Now when we call the working group a group that is a flippant remark as there was only 2 in it. Andrew Barber and Jayne Glass. Sadly Jayne had very little knowledge of deer across Scotland. This was a set up of the highest order by The Scottish government through at the time SNH. Anyone that follows this needs there head examined. Please remember there are many that make cor-pious amounts money from deer management. So shooting more males will lead to more deer and the goose that lays the golden egg will stay for some time yet.

 

[David Barker]

It's not the scope's responsibility to identify the hazard though. That is the responsibility of the shooter and always will be no matter whether it's daylight, or night time, with a lamp, night vision or thermal.

Unless I misunderstand the position is to allow image intensifying devices for shooting. Unless people are using their scopes to scan and locate deer, then surely the target and backstop, and it's safety would have already been idenitified by other means.

Stephen do you realy belive what you are writing. People will use what ever they can afford. We have problems with NV being used on top of cross bow,s in Glasgow spears bows and arrows Air rifles etc. Do not credit people with the same sense as those that have spent hard cash colletting information to pass tests and examinations in deer management. Most on here are not the ones we need to worry about. Nutcases creeping about our urban areas with now legal pour quality NV Thermal shooting at anything that glows.

 

[jimmy milnes]

It's not the scope's responsibility to identify the hazard though. That is the responsibility of the shooter and always will be no matter whether it's daylight, or night time, with a lamp, night vision or thermal.

Unless I misunderstand the position is to allow image intensifying devices for shooting. Unless people are using their scopes to scan and locate deer, then surely the target and backstop, and it's safety would have already been idenitified by other means.

Hopefully to both paragraphs Stephen.
Jimmy.

 

[stubear]

Can the public respond to this one? I didn’t see an option on the BASC site

 

[StephenToast]

Hopefully to both paragraphs Stephen.
Jimmy.

Indeed.

But as I said, the argument stands for day scopes. For which there is no minimum standard. In fact there is no requirement to have a scope of any sort.

There is no legal requirement for minimum standard or maintenance of rifles, only minimum calibre.

Or minimum standard of binoculars.

It is the shooter who is reaponsibke to ensure all of their equipment is fit for purpose.

 

[StephenToast]

Stephen do you realy belive what you are writing. People will use what ever they can afford. We have problems with NV being used on top of cross bow,s in Glasgow spears bows and arrows Air rifles etc. Do not credit people with the same sense as those that have spent hard cash colletting information to pass tests and examinations in deer management. Most on here are not the ones we need to worry about. Nutcases creeping about our urban areas with now legal pour quality NV Thermal shooting at anything that glows.

How does illegal activity have any relevance to a proposed change in the law?

Whatever the law is those people will continue to act illegally.

 

[homer]

Or, the introduction of closed seasons. for foxes

Your not serious surely?

 

[StephenToast]

Your not serious surely?

Well, no. But the logic is sound. Why should deer have closed seasons when foxes don't? There is no argument against the removal of the season for male deer that stands any scrutiny based on welfare, particularly when BASC support their members who choose to shoot, snare and put dogs to ground for fox control.

 

[Boosh]

Some of the average NV scopes would give a way better picture at twilight times than a lot of glass scopes, giving a safer shot and confirmed target without doubt that many glass scopes cannot.
As for reprobates using them, yes that will happen whatever the law states.
As for thermal scopes then maybe anybody trigger happy could possibly be making mistakes.