Carcase Quality

[Dan Newcombe]

That’s a cop out. Yes the dealers should reject and not pay for crap carcasses BUT to be able to put a carcass in a game dealer you need a trained hunter number. The clue is in the name TRAINED.
The DMQ falls well short of those being trained and assessed properly. They have made it easier to pass because they see it as a cash cow. As a consequence the DMQ must shoulder some of the responsibility of poor carcass management as they are the ones setting the bar very low.

I don’t really agree - you get the ‘training’ and you get told what is required and the standards that need to be met, you then figure out how to achieve that.

When I started out we just figured it out ourselves mainly based on scaling up a rabbit process. Over the years I have been shown bits and pieces that I have used but I bet I do it differently to plenty of people on here to achieve the same end result so as long as I’ve been told what is required on the training why should I need to be shown 100 different ways to do it? (To be clear, I think the DMQ is a necessary evil and a total crock but ……).

It’s your responsibility to learn how to do these things - don’t go blaming the qualification process. Level 1 gives you the theory and you work out the practice, level 2 assess the practical skill you have developed - Simple’s.

Regardless, people will have different standards - if a carcass isn’t flat jointed I will judge you, doesn’t mean it’s not a clean carcass to go into the food chain. You will always get dirty gits who have no concept that they are useless.

 

[sauer]

I was lucky
A family member as a mentor to keep me right
Many don’t have this they have to figure it out on their own…

Yeah my dsc1 when I did it years ago … you bought the cd rom did the studying and it was a 1 day affair on safety, the deer species etc and shooting test….,
No one showed you how to tunnel and anal protrusion or scrape and tie off food pipe ….that was shown over and over again in prep. For my level2 … again by my family mentor

Bottom line a person has to WANT to have standards or even give a sh1t … many don’t … once triggers pulled and it’s down the rest is just hassle .. they are already thinking of next beast so don’t expect any level of pride or standards …

You’re always gong to have a bad element in any demographic ….

Deerstalkings no different


Paul

 

[willie_gunn]

I also hear that the whole buisiness of dealing with a shot deer can be spread out over a few animals. With bits signed off on each. In other words they don’t need to do the whole job start to finish on one animal.

So no different to the old DSC2 then?

 

[Dunwaters]

That’s a cop out. Yes the dealers should reject and not pay for crap carcasses BUT to be able to put a carcass in a game dealer you need a trained hunter number. The clue is in the name TRAINED.
The DMQ falls well short of those being trained and assessed properly. They have made it easier to pass because they see it as a cash cow. As a consequence the DMQ must shoulder some of the responsibility of poor carcass management as they are the ones setting the bar very low.

It’s not a cop out.
The stalker is presenting sub standard carcasses, the dealer is processing them and selling them on so there’s an obvious lack of enforcement.
If the dealers were being regularly inspected and fined for breaches that would percolate down to the stalker’s pretty quickly and standards would improve.

 

[SussexSteve]

Standards need to be raised by stalkers. The little badges doesn't mean we have to stop learning and bettering ourselves especially where gralloching and carcass handing is concerned. It isn't hard really to present a good carcass if you have a bit of pride in what your doing. Gamedealers are a business at the end of the day, there to make money, what they accept is beyond our control. If they want the standards lifted it wouldn't be hard to hold some demo evenings where stalkers could come in and see how to do a better job

 

[308tikka]

If they want the standards lifted it wouldn't be hard to hold some demo evenings where stalkers could come in and see how to do a better job

The DI used to do this.....

 

[Dunwaters]

Standards need to be raised by stalkers. The little badges doesn't mean we have to stop learning and bettering ourselves especially where gralloching and carcass handing is concerned. It isn't hard really to present a good carcass if you have a bit of pride in what your doing. Gamedealers are a business at the end of the day, there to make money, what they accept is beyond our control. If they want the standards lifted it wouldn't be hard to hold some demo evenings where stalkers could come in and see how to do a better job

If you want to raise standards then you are going to have to enforce the regulations and signs are that that is just not happening evenly.
My local weigh and pay has a new veterinary inspector, much tougher to please than the old one and he’s discarding carcasses he deems unfit. The standard has improved noticeably.

 

[308tikka]

As someone who infrequently uses a GD, but mentors others in stalking and gralloching, I am slightly at a loss as to what a GD wouldnt accept (costs adjusted).

What does one have to present for a GD to decline ?

I mean this as in, I try to produce good carcasses, but it would appear GDs will take any old crap and pay accordingly.

 

[User00040]

As someone who infrequently uses a GD, but mentors others in stalking and gralloching, I am slightly at a loss as to what a GD wouldnt accept (costs adjusted).

What does one have to present for a GD to decline ?

I mean this as in, I try to produce good carcasses, but it would appear GDs will take any old crap and pay accordingly.

GD's don't refuse deer, they just charge the supplier of the carcass for disposal.

 

[Tim.243]

GD's don't refuse deer, they just charge the supplier of the carcass for disposal.

You do talk some tosh, any thing not fit for purpose goes in the bin...
Summer fly blown pigeons is a prime example that is why the trays are tagged...!!

 

[Overlay]

The DI used to do this.....

yep
you never know what you’ve lost until it’s gone
The literature they had on line was heavily read by many, one of the best guide for stalkers available.

 

[Pete6.5]

The good thing about training is if something happens you can't hide behind "I didn't know that" because you have been told and then choose to ignore it

 

[kieran222]

If they want the standards lifted it wouldn't be hard to hold some demo evenings where stalkers could come in and see how to do a better job

Sounds good but as you said, it isn't hard to produce a good quality carcase if you are bothered. I think that a lot of the poor carcase are from people who can't be bothered so are unlikely to be interested in attending a demo evening. Processing the carcase is probably just a major inconvenience to some stalkers.
If you have done the required courses to allow you to sell the carcase, then you have all of the info needed and should understand food handling and hygiene. After that it's whether you are bothered to put the effort in, this is most likely the issue.

 

[big ears]

So no different to the old DSC2 then?

Maybe not yours but hugely different to mine. I was questioned and fully expected to sort each deer from squeezing the trigger to putting it in the larder. All the time watched by the AW.

 

[big ears]

The DI used to do this.....

Yes and then steel your stalking. Bunch of crooks the DI we are all better off without them.

 

[308tikka]

Yes and then steel your stalking. Bunch of crooks the DI we are all better off without them.

did they steal yours?

 

[willie_gunn]

Maybe not yours but hugely different to mine. I was questioned and fully expected to sort each deer from squeezing the trigger to putting it in the larder. All the time watched by the AW.

Nothing in what you’ve written addresses the point I made, in that it was permissible under the old DSC2 scheme for Candidates to complete an ICR using multiple outings, and multiple deer.

Perhaps you could just acknowledge that fact, and accept that the specific criticism you made of the new DSC2 scheme would have been equally valid under the old scheme?

 

[big ears]

Nothing in what you’ve written addresses the point I made, in that it was permissible under the old DSC2 scheme for Candidates to complete an ICR using multiple outings, and multiple deer.

Perhaps you could just acknowledge that fact, and accept that the specific criticism you made of the new DSC2 scheme would have been equally valid under the old scheme?

Ok yes the old was not perfect and the odd crap candidate got through. Now the DMQ is worse and the bar set lower so more crap candidates pass but since the DMQ is more about money raising they don’t care.

Do you acknowledge that? As it stands DMQ have lowered the standard max by which they assess candidates?

BE

 

[big ears]

did they steal yours?

Bloody nearly did until we got wise.

 

[willie_gunn]

Ok yes the old was not perfect and the odd crap candidate got through. Now the DMQ is worse and the bar set lower so more crap candidates pass but since the DMQ is more about money raising they don’t care.

Do you acknowledge that? As it stands DMQ have lowered the standard max by which they assess candidates?

BE

Are you an AW?