Carcase Quality

[baguio]

Why after many years of leg work and meetings would I come on here and tell everyone. It's part of my business and I wouldn't expect you to tell me what you earn from your main business.
I've known a few butchers (not just game) to do very well build very successful businesses and then retired very comfortable but that doesn't go for all.

As I thought!

 

[Pete6.5]

What you say would work but would rely on one person checking every new carcass before it is processed (whilst still in the skin) The reality is that will not happen as they don’t want the hassle.
I like the idea but to work will need to be written in law and the GD fined if they don’t comply.
Don’t get me wrong I think 100% GD should block stalkers who present bad carcasses for a 12 month period in the first instance then for ever if it happen again. It would concentrate the mind a bit.

Vets already check and stamp all carcasses. granted after skinning. A saddle shot deer is not a health risk and a deduction is fair. But a green or contaminated carcass takes seconds (most of the time) to find and spray

 

[John Doe]

And he is an assessor. Questions who trained the trainers.
Five yearly refresher courses/witnessed stalks would be a good idea

He said he was an AW not an Assessor, big difference.

 

[Selous]

And he is an assessor. Questions who trained the trainers.
Five yearly refresher courses/witnessed stalks would be a good idea

Not an assessor, a witness

 

[baguio]

I already do and I already benefit from a higher than normal game dealer price because I promise before the season on quality of carcass.

Well I have never heard of that and I am part of groups who deal in decent numbers of reliable quality. The price is the price. Take it or leave it. I fail to see how the dealer benefits from any deal that pays extra to one man/group unless they seriously need that man's carcasses to keep in business. The quality is a standard. Lower quality means lower prices. Simples! They certainly don't need to pay people extra around East Anglia. Too many deer and not enough buyers.

 

[Overlay]

Well I have never heard of that and I am part of groups who deal in decent numbers of reliable quality. The price is the price. Take it or leave it. I fail to see how the dealer benefits from any deal that pays extra to one man/group unless they seriously need that man's carcasses to keep in business. The quality is a standard. Lower quality means lower prices. Simples! They certainly don't need to pay people extra around East Anglia. Too many deer and not enough buyers.

yep i agreed my fallow price before the season for all well shot placement deer, anything else is a goeshomer, i wouldn’t put in or expect to be paid for it anyway, i’d prefer to break it down give it away if it was knocked about, no need to knock the guts out of reasonable price just to get rid of a carcase

 

[big ears]

Not an assessor, a witness

So do AW not make comments on performance?

 

[Selous]

So do AW not make comments on performance?

Only in so far as recording if a performance criteria has been achieved.

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

Well I have never heard of that and I am part of groups who deal in decent numbers of reliable quality. The price is the price. Take it or leave it. I fail to see how the dealer benefits from any deal that pays extra to one man/group unless they seriously need that man's carcasses to keep in business. The quality is a standard. Lower quality means lower prices. Simples! They certainly don't need to pay people extra around East Anglia. Too many deer and not enough buyers.

I can get rid of mine by the heap and at a lovely price ta very much

 

[baguio]

I can get rid of mine by the heap and at a lovely price ta very much

Just be careful and don't let the debts build up!

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

Just be careful and don't let the debts build up!

Paid bang on, 7-10 days not waited any longer and not failed to as as yet!

Think out of the box and don’t listen to too many people, and then you might earn a few more quid!

 

[baguio]

Paid bang on, 7-10 days not waited any longer and not failed to as as yet!

Think out of the box and don’t listen to too many people, and then you might earn a few more quid!

One of my mates nearly got burned mate. Took a good while, a lot of FB 'discussions' and a load of excuses before he eventually got paid. Not dealt with him since. Only giving you a friendly warning.

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

One of my mates nearly got burned mate. Took a good while, a lot of FB 'discussions' and a load of excuses before he eventually got paid. Not dealt with him since. Only giving you a friendly warning.

I’ll carry on, cash is not my be all and end all, unlike everybody else who kills deer seems to want to make a fortune, the guys done me, no harm, paid on the button, so far, I’ve had nothing deducted from bullet damage, and even better I have not had the expense of driving it everywhere, like everybody else does, to me, that’s worth 80p a kilo on its own!

so as far I’m concerned, happy days!

 

[SussexSteve]

I’ll carry on, cash is not my be all and end all, unlike everybody else who kills deer seems to want to make a fortune, the guys done me, no harm, paid on the button, so far, I’ve had nothing deducted from bullet damage, and even better I have not had the expense of driving it everywhere, like everybody else does, to me, that’s worth 80p a kilo on its own!

so as far I’m concerned, happy days!

He's been straight up with me too Lee always paid never a deduction. Gamedealers will always want well shot well presented carcasses year round those sending messy ones in will only get rid while demand is high

 

[Overlay]

Your gonna knocked for a carcase or two I know I have and one from someone I didn’t really expect

Thats life and a learning curve, for me it happens just the once and I move on, If I’m honest I can’t be bothered to get all Mardy over a couple quid, the people I use haven’t let me down and I ensure I don’t let them down either by providing well shot, gralloched and stored correctly animals to be collected, it’s worth it as NDS stated no further contribution required job done money comes in all done and dusted

 

[big ears]

Only in so far as recording if a performance criteria has been achieved.

So in other words they are assessing a candidate against prescribed performance criteria.
They are performing an assessment and therefore an assessor.

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

What makes me chuckle is, everyone is busting a gut, still trying to make a fortune out of venison

The meat markets are like whores draws, they go up and down and thats fact!

Even if all stalkers produced a grade A carcass 100% all of the time, the price is still governed by demand!

Everyone needs to get their head around that!

High quality carcasses is an absolute must, but the price will be what it will be!

Beer and bullets nothing more!

 

[willie_gunn]

So in other words they are assessing a candidate against prescribed performance criteria.
They are performing an assessment and therefore an assessor.

Other than the Candidate, there are two distinct roles when it comes to DSC2 - Approved Witnesses and Assessors. Formal assessment of the Candidate is only done by Assessor.

Approved Witness:

"The role of the Approved Witness (AW) is to give candidates opportunities to demonstrate their competence and to confirm their knowledge, and record that they have done so in accordance with DMQ set standards. "

So the AW's, who are volunteers, take the Candidate out - ideally on a single stalk - and witness the Candidate's ability to meet the Performance Criteria in the Independent Cull Report (ICR). The AW asks minimal questions of the Candidate, and only where directed to do so on the ICR. Both the Candidate and the AW then submit their respective copies of the ICR to the Assessor.

Assessor:

"The Assessor will check and evaluate the evidence against the DMQ standard and will offer advice to candidates. Assessors carry a professional standing in the area of deer management and also hold a National Assessor Qualification."

So the Assessor reviews both ICR's that have been submitted and then, through questioning of the Candidate and AW, assesses whether the evidence documented in the ICR meets the standard required. The Assessor can question the Candidate about their capabilities and knowledge, and ask for additional evidence as necessary (e.g. to complete another stalk).

Also note that, when it comes to the Assessors, "Internal Quality Assurers are appointed by Assessment Centres. They ensure that assessments are carried out fairly and thoroughly and that all Assessors are working to the same standard. All evidence is reviewed by an Internal Verifier."

You can find more information here.

 

[Dan Newcombe]

Other than the Candidate, there are two distinct roles when it comes to DSC2 - Approved Witnesses and Assessors. Formal assessment of the Candidate is only done by Assessor.

Approved Witness:

"The role of the Approved Witness (AW) is to give candidates opportunities to demonstrate their competence and to confirm their knowledge, and record that they have done so in accordance with DMQ set standards. "

So the AW's, who are volunteers, take the Candidate out - ideally on a single stalk - and witness the Candidate's ability to meet the Performance Criteria in the Independent Cull Report (ICR). The AW asks minimal questions of the Candidate, and only where directed to do so on the ICR. Both the Candidate and the AW then submit their respective copies of the ICR to the Assessor.

Assessor:

"The Assessor will check and evaluate the evidence against the DMQ standard and will offer advice to candidates. Assessors carry a professional standing in the area of deer management and also hold a National Assessor Qualification."

So the Assessor reviews both ICR's that have been submitted and then, through questioning of the Candidate and AW, assesses whether the evidence documented in the ICR meets the standard required. The Assessor can question the Candidate about their capabilities and knowledge, and ask for additional evidence as necessary (e.g. to complete another stalk).

Also note that, when it comes to the Assessors, "Internal Quality Assurers are appointed by Assessment Centres. They ensure that assessments are carried out fairly and thoroughly and that all Assessors are working to the same standard. All evidence is reviewed by an Internal Verifier."

You can find more information here.

But - and it’s important. The witness needs to know the rules surely?

 

[willie_gunn]

But - and it’s important. The witness needs to know the rules surely?

Yes, of course.

The AW's receive regular briefings on the expectations of their role, how they should witness Candidates, and how to complete the ICR.

You can see the most recent AW Briefing here.