Make a case for it saving the Tax Payer money and it will sail through. Surely? Probably not!
K
K
Home office consultation on deregulating sound moderators
- Thread starter ZimCoxy136
- Start date
kenbro
Well-Known Member
Absolutely probably…
Kb.
Yes but if moderators were off certificate then even ones with serial numbers would be untraceable, so no difference!Think of the anarchy though.
My "unknown" brand, and "unknown" serial moderator would be completely untraceable
Hornet
Well-Known Member
Like lots of other round metal tubes, let's face it, that's all they are!
They could also boast about reducing the number of firearms in circulation!
Moderators show up as “firearms” on headline Home Office statistics.
Moderators show up as “firearms” on headline Home Office statistics.
This point has been made numerous times, along with pointing out the time that FLD's would save!
Unfortunately I suspect that Liebour have allocated all of Parliament time to bills increasing Taxes, with nothing left for sensible laws!
8x57
Distinguished Member
I have doubts over the accuracy of the percentages as quoted, perhaps the percentages quoted just need qualifying or given some context, (e.g. for firearms held by deer stalkers only).
Think about it- there are far more target shooters in the U.K. than those that just stalk deer or those using firearms for vermin/small game. Many of those target shooters will own several firearms. The majority of target shooters will not use a sound moderator. Therefore I would expect that the percentage of firearms to sound moderators would be much higher than the 57% quoted. There are also some stalkers who do not possess a moderator or only have one moderator shared between a couple of rifles.
Therefore I would have expected to see the figure to be more like 80-90% rifles and 15-20% moderators (ignoring the small percentage that don't quite fall into either category).
None the less taking even 15-20% out of the firearms equation seems very logical and will save time and wasted effort.
Stalker62
Well-Known Member
@8x57
I would find that surprising.
I have moderators on all my 'target' rifles - but then there are 'historic' rifles (and BP) which of course do not have them fitted.
Do you have the data?
Just did a quick tally of mine - 13% of my F/As are moderators - but I have a very modest collection of historic military and BP.
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8x57
Distinguished Member
No I don't have the data all I have is 40+ years of personal experience of rifle and pistol clubs, that's why I am curious as to whether the figures quoted is qualified in some way.
I think that most shooters tend think only on or focus solely on those disciplines that they personally involved and are unaware of other forms of shooting and the equipment involved, therefore there may be a tendency to generalise or assume that everyone is the same.
Just had another though on how figures could be affected - section 1 shotguns and FAC air rifles.
I think that most shooters tend think only on or focus solely on those disciplines that they personally involved and are unaware of other forms of shooting and the equipment involved, therefore there may be a tendency to generalise or assume that everyone is the same.
Just had another though on how figures could be affected - section 1 shotguns and FAC air rifles.
In June 2023 I did an FOI request to Police Scotland on the number of moderators held of firearm certificates.
The response stated that 36% of the firearms held on FACs were sound moderators
This is pretty much in line for the figures published for England and Wales
Cheers
Bruce
The response stated that 36% of the firearms held on FACs were sound moderators
This is pretty much in line for the figures published for England and Wales
Cheers
Bruce
8x57
Distinguished Member
With all due respect Bruce the situation in Scotland may be entirely different to England and Wales. I would expect deer stalking to be far more popular in Scotland than in E&W with a higher percentage of deer stalker s as opposed to target shooters so I wouldn't disbelieve that figure for Scotland. In this day and age the majority of stalkers will be using a moderator.
My evidence for saying that the situation is pretty much the same in Scotland as it is in England and Wales is based on the published figures for England and Wales.
In fact it was those published figures for England and Wales that made me make the FOI request of Police Scotland
So, based on published information from the police in Scotland, England and Wales, the percentage of moderators held on FACs is around 34-36%
I wouldn't call that "entirely different"
Cheers
Bruce
8x57
Distinguished Member
Maybe not entirely different but my reasoning for thinking that the quoted 33% may be high or may relate only to those using sporting rifles in the field is.
1. Consider the significant number of small bore target rifles that are not used with a moderator.
2. Consider the number of "pure" target rifles that do not use a moderator.
3. Consider the number of gallery rifles both centrefire and rimfire that do not have a moderator.
4. Consider the number of LBR's and LBP's that do not have a moderator.
5. Consider the number of muzzle loading pistols that do not have a moderator.
6. Consider the number of classic rifles that do not have a moderator.
7. Consider the number of section 1 shotguns used for practical and target shotgun shooting.
8. Many FAC air rifles may have moderators but some may not.
All of these combined would make a fairly large percentage of firearms to which you then add the number of "stalking" rifles which makes me doubt the veracity of the figures given unless there is some overriding factor not stated.
My thinking is based on a rifle club of which I was a member that had 170 members. Rather unusually for a target shooting club we had a fairly significant number of members who stalked possibly 30 - 35. All or almost all of the stalkers had sound moderators, often one per rifle that they owned but some like myself had only one centrefire sound moderator for four stalking rifles. It was rare for one of the target only shooters to have a sound moderator. I can think of several other local clubs where stalkers were significantly less represented. Last week I was on a range day where of the thirty plus shooters only a few were using sound moderators.
Therefore I just wonder if a figure has been quoted that represents only one sector of the shooting community and not the whole picture.
1. Consider the significant number of small bore target rifles that are not used with a moderator.
2. Consider the number of "pure" target rifles that do not use a moderator.
3. Consider the number of gallery rifles both centrefire and rimfire that do not have a moderator.
4. Consider the number of LBR's and LBP's that do not have a moderator.
5. Consider the number of muzzle loading pistols that do not have a moderator.
6. Consider the number of classic rifles that do not have a moderator.
7. Consider the number of section 1 shotguns used for practical and target shotgun shooting.
8. Many FAC air rifles may have moderators but some may not.
All of these combined would make a fairly large percentage of firearms to which you then add the number of "stalking" rifles which makes me doubt the veracity of the figures given unless there is some overriding factor not stated.
My thinking is based on a rifle club of which I was a member that had 170 members. Rather unusually for a target shooting club we had a fairly significant number of members who stalked possibly 30 - 35. All or almost all of the stalkers had sound moderators, often one per rifle that they owned but some like myself had only one centrefire sound moderator for four stalking rifles. It was rare for one of the target only shooters to have a sound moderator. I can think of several other local clubs where stalkers were significantly less represented. Last week I was on a range day where of the thirty plus shooters only a few were using sound moderators.
Therefore I just wonder if a figure has been quoted that represents only one sector of the shooting community and not the whole picture.
nun_hunter
Well-Known Member
By your own logic you're thinking about rhe circles you move in and rifles you see people using, which is influenced by the type of shooting you do and who you do it with.
Opposit to you I have as many moderators as I do rifles with only shotguns being unmoderated. Everyone I know that shoots is in the same position so would be easy for me to suggest that from my experience the number of moderators may be even higher. However, I'll just go along with what the FOI requests show.
8x57
Distinguished Member
On the contrary nun_hunter its because I have engaged in different forms of shooting that I am aware that deer stalking and the sporting use of rifles although rapidly expanding isn't a very large sector of the whole shooting community, and the reason I ask about the percentage quoted or the actual wording regarding where that percentage came from.
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