Paid stalk and variation question

[marktherebel]

Good afternoon you lovely people!

I have a question about how it works regarding booking on a paid stalk and the person providing the service also providing a letter which would allow a variation?

I have a closed ticket for target shooting and have been helping a friend out with some vermin control and some stalking with his rifles on land he has permission on. I’m trying desperately to get my own permission but as you all know it’s not as easy as it seems!

I contacted someone who provides stalks in the Scottish Borders but he unequivocally stated I could not book with him and under no circumstances would he provide a letter of authorisation to suffice for a variation for a stalking rifle. He only takes out experienced stalkers.

Would this be the same across the board? Or will some providers of stalking services provide an authorisation letter ? Is it a bit of a mixed bag or is it rare to find someone that would provide a letter or is it rarer that someone would not provide a letter?

Just looking to get a feel.

Thank you
Mark

 

[Stalker62]

No one it their right mind, is going to provide any 'recommendation' for someone they do not know.

They may provide 'evidence' that you have booked a stalk, and that 'may' be sufficient for your FLD to issue a grant.

It will not get you an 'open' certificate.

Don't be in too much of a rush. It will all come. Just enjoy the journey.

 

[Rookandrabbit]

I am in a similar position whereby I have paid for several stalks and kindly obtained confirmation letters but as yet not sought a variation to my licence authority.
Been using the BASC mentoring scheme and also private providers for guided stalking.
The bonus is you get to use different rifles and ammunition………downside is they are set up for the guides and not everybody is the same size or shape.
Good luck in your endeavours.

P. s mentor wanted Lancashire Merseyside Cheshire North Wales areas for DSC2 experience …asking for a friend, honest!
Regards Rookandrabbit.

 

[Overlay]

Best way is to create a log listing the days you’ve been out as experience and ask if ok with his permission to include his phone number if he wouldn’t mind as your going to apply for open type cert

Don’t be surprised if it’s a no, people are people some Will some wont]

It’s a log of your paid stalking experience it’s irrelevant whether they’ve written up stalk for you or just the date
Create the right picture

 

[VSS]

Get receipts for the stalks you've paid for and been on, and confirmation letters for future bookings. That should be all that's required.

When I first went stalking, like you I asked my guide if I could use him as a reference in support of my application for a variation for a deer legal calibre. He said no. At the time I felt that a bit harsh, as he was obviously very happy to help me, as a newbie, in many other ways.
Now I'm older, wiser, and have some stalking experience under my belt, I fully understand his stance and I would do likewise.

 

[Heym SR20]

Paid for stalking is always down to the individuals concerned. I have had both good and bad experiences.

I would get some stalking under your belt, keep receipts/ confirmation of the stalks. Once you have found whom you like stalking with and they are happy mentoring then you will be in a good place.

I would also do your DSC level 1 and add all this to your portfolio.

In the eyes of the licensing authorities there is a huge world of difference between the very controlled shooting on a range, to very uncontrolled shooting out in the field after deer. The licencing authorities want the evidence so that they are confident that risks to the public are at a minimum when they grant you an authorisation to use a rifle for deer or vermin.

 

[SteveW]

I did my DSC1 prior to applying for my firearms ,was I granted the 2 calibres I asked for, the covering letter from the chief constable which I would imagine is pretty standard, asked me to provide written evidence going forward of guided stalking experience ,and until that time my license would be closed.
I was taking stalking with the same guides on a fairly regular basis but knowing that if I asked them to write a letter for me every time they took me stalking I'm sure they would have stopped taking me out/or found an excuse to say they couldn't!
With this in mind I printed a compliment slip size piece of paper as attached, filled all the relevant info out that I could and the stalker would just have to sign and comment on my etiquette/ability!
They both puffed and panted a bit the first time, but were fine after that. I probably gathered about 12 of these and sent them on and was then given open ticket
Also when I did my DSC 1 with one of these guides he kindly wrote a letter to the police which I was able to attach to my application, informing them if/when they granted my license he had no problem taking me out on his ground stalking with him!
Nothing wrong with finding people you're happy to be mentored by and take as much knowledge and skill from them as they will offer!

 

[sikamalc]

I get asked this all the time.

I have taken out all sorts of abilities over many years. In some cases I am asked to produce a reference for a client to renew or apply for a Certificate. As a rule I don't give out references to people who just book one stalk with me. I prefer to get to know them a little better first.

I always ask them to pay for a stalk up front first, as on the very odd occasion in the past I have not done so, and they have walked away with a receipt for booking a stalk, with out attending. This was swiftly reported to their FEO. And no re booking with me.

I also make it clear that the name of the grounds I have is NOT to be put on their certificate. I have had this occur several times in the past, and had it taken off. However I still get some FEO's ringing me up to discuss a candidate, and then ask for the name of the estate or grounds I have, which I refuse to give to them. IT IS NOT A REQUIREMENT.

Many FEO's maintain they need the name of the ground. If a client is paying to be guided on my ground, they are there by payment or invitation. You cannot put the name of the ground on a clients certificate as it is not their ground, nor do they lease or own it. I own the lease.

Good luck with your application

 

[Cogswell & Harrison]

I'm in a similar position as the op. My mentor advised me to keep diary of the days events and after a couple more stalks submit the summaries along with his name and contact details. Now, I would not expect him to "vouch" for me as an individual shooter nor would I risk an awkward situation by asking him to. All he needs to commit to is confirmation of my write up being factual and that's sufficient for my local FLO. I would add though that within my ".243 granted for target" variation I committed myself to the process of, variation request - grant for target - DSC1 - mentoring - request open certificate for .243.

 

[tim@tcs]

There are a few excellent ghillies who will take novices on the hill with estate rifles
The hind cull is usually a good time but we went mob handed a team of four, two experienced and two novices so we could do a pairing with day on day off!
It was good for all of us

 

[gelert]

Good afternoon you lovely people!

I have a question about how it works regarding booking on a paid stalk and the person providing the service also providing a letter which would allow a variation?

I have a closed ticket for target shooting and have been helping a friend out with some vermin control and some stalking with his rifles on land he has permission on. I’m trying desperately to get my own permission but as you all know it’s not as easy as it seems!

I contacted someone who provides stalks in the Scottish Borders but he unequivocally stated I could not book with him and under no circumstances would he provide a letter of authorisation to suffice for a variation for a stalking rifle. He only takes out experienced stalkers.

Would this be the same across the board? Or will some providers of stalking services provide an authorisation letter ? Is it a bit of a mixed bag or is it rare to find someone that would provide a letter or is it rarer that someone would not provide a letter?

Just looking to get a feel.

Thank you
Mark

I'd first book another guide,one that's able and professional enough to take out novices.Weve all had to start somewhere.

If your friend is taking you under his wing,could he not write a covering letter like a mentor/ referee saying your helping him with his cull on his ground etc?

 

[lovingit]

Join a syndicate is what I did. Then gave the people the list kf 100s of acres I have access to. They have spaces if anyone needs help. That way you hey open ticket amd can go wherever you want afterwards