tim@tcs
Well-Known Member
Not down here yet although I can see the way it looks like going
Shoot more Deer !
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sikamalc
Administrator
Subtle............. Yes I stop killing in February. A common line ehh. Well some of us have been stalking many years, and when we have taken enough off any ground after all winter long stalking then its up to me and anyone else how we manage ground. NOT your decision or anyone else's.
Makes me smile when some people have to invite several people to suddenly start culling more, if they have not got the time themselves. But then it appears we have a banned member back again, but under a different name, but still banging the same old drum. There will be a bloody hole in it if he keeps banging it much louder on here
.Who's the we anyway, pray do tell ???
But for how much longer will it be your decision, that's the question?
devon deer stalker
Well-Known Member
Reading between the lines, some guides, although I suspect not many, fit into the scenario of keeping the ground for their clients and not controlling them, leaving the medal heads for the money, that isn't good, if any of my landowners knew I was doing the same I would be kicked off pronto, although these days getting a replacement that does a thorough job might not be so easy.
If I'm not out guiding I'm stalking between the clients visits, I have zero tolerance for deer these days, they have become a pest, and need killing until brought down to sustainable levels, which will probably never happen.
As for retaining ground, and none being around, total nonsense.
Through my existing landowners I gave away some new ground to a @sam84 stalker near me, 22 acres, after I negotiated with the neighbouring farmer this has now turned into over 60 acres, not for me, for the other stalker, why you might ask?, because the chap has a cracking little son that is welded to his hip, only 10 years old but being raised in country ways, and a new deer stalker in the making, it's roe stalking with the chance of the odd fallow and red.
At the same time, through the same contact, I was given a large farm to shoot reds on, I have been interested in it for years, but never approached the farmer, so my friend gets 60 acres, and I get some more red stalking, we both win.
We will get the job done, I just hope the 'others' do their job.
If I'm not out guiding I'm stalking between the clients visits, I have zero tolerance for deer these days, they have become a pest, and need killing until brought down to sustainable levels, which will probably never happen.
As for retaining ground, and none being around, total nonsense.
Through my existing landowners I gave away some new ground to a @sam84 stalker near me, 22 acres, after I negotiated with the neighbouring farmer this has now turned into over 60 acres, not for me, for the other stalker, why you might ask?, because the chap has a cracking little son that is welded to his hip, only 10 years old but being raised in country ways, and a new deer stalker in the making, it's roe stalking with the chance of the odd fallow and red.
At the same time, through the same contact, I was given a large farm to shoot reds on, I have been interested in it for years, but never approached the farmer, so my friend gets 60 acres, and I get some more red stalking, we both win.
We will get the job done, I just hope the 'others' do their job.
sikamalc
Administrator
For as long as I like.
I am not saying there is not a problem with numbers. Especially Fallow, which to my mind have overtaken Muntjac. But we all know that not every landowner wants deer shot. There are always various reasons, my wife like to see them, or my cousin has a rifle and shoots them................I could go on.
But there is some crap written on here by some folk. You can manage deer if you put the time in, but only up to the limits of your own ground. But don't start telling me that if your a professional stalker and make a living out of it that you are one of the causes for a population explosion of deer.
Covid has played a part in my opinion. MANY recreational stalkers never got out for well over several months, and in the middle of the doe season. That didn't help at all, and Fallow in particular had a free run, along with other species too.
Whatever anyone thinks, deer are to treated with respect, not vermin. If anyone wants to kill every deer on their ground, that's up to them. Whether they throw it open to some members on here, or invite the new band of lady stalkers, I don't care. Its their ground, its their problem. But don't start throwing mud at everyone else that stalks, telling them to shoot every deer that walks the face of the earth.
But if the fallow herds in the Midlands keep on growing as they are then landowners will most likely be instructed to cull them - or lose their agricultural support payments. Regardless of whether the like seeing deer on their land or not. So the decision will be out of the stalker's hands.
sikamalc
Administrator
Well good for you. Good to hear you can pick up ground quickly. I get VERY few people want medals. Most like yourself just want to fill their freezers. But as deer stalkers deer are NOT vermin, and need to be treated with respect, despite what Lee thinks or anyone else.
sikamalc
Administrator
Midlands......
try looking around the start of the A12 off the M25. And there are some serious numbers in that area.But again if the landowners don't want them shot, there's little to be done. And if anyone on here has permission, they had better sort it out. So its not the stalkers problem, its the landowners. How many times do we see Youtube video of large numbers of Fallow running across roads. So who owns the grounds?? may be someone does stalk the area, possibly not ? I agree areas such as this need hitting hard.
Again I will say, that some of the stupid comments on here seem to be aimed at professional stalkers. If anyone thinks that full time stalkers are the cause of over population they are kidding themselves. Yes, there are people who have many acres, 10,000 plus or more, that are only recreational, or make a few quid at a weekend, but don't tar everyone with the same brush.
devon deer stalker
Well-Known Member
Thank you, I think.
I don't really understand the 'vermin' against 'respect' statement though, if I see a herd of Fallow I select the easiest shot first, and then shoot until my magazine is empty, but I haven't treated them without respect, well placed chest shots, leading to a quick death, vermin, well yes, that's how many farmers see them who lose £1000's of crops/grass etc times are changing I'm afraid
big ears
Well-Known Member
Sorry malc wasn’t aimed at you but as they say if the cap fits! Also a bit aggressive response I’d say to a honest opinion.
We have many down here who go soft around February and wont shoot pregnant does. The fact that the roe have been pregnant for months slips their attention.
We have a deer problem, fact. We need to shoot more deer, fact. In my opinion we should shoot all in season deer to the end of the season. Others may disagree but surely we are all entitled to our own views.
BE
sikamalc
Administrator
I agree, I do the same with Fallow. But I also take the shot where ever its safe with Fallow, they are a problematic deer, and numbers are out of control. I know how much damage they do.
But as some keep laying the blame at full time deer stalkers door, I am not excepting that, neither am I excepting comments regarding all deer are vermin and need to be shot on sight.
Agreed. The owner of a 400 acre farm, mixed arable, pasture, mostly woodland, that I recently got permission on, probably has 80 'resident' red deer on, plus many roe, told me 'that's enough for now, I like to leave nature to do what it does in the spring'. I've shot 2 reds and 1 roe!
sikamalc
Administrator
Yep, no problem if that's what you need to do. I have areas for Roe where we have a manageable population. But I picked up another 350 acres last year and we have had to make an impact on there. The farmer wanted the population reduced to 50%. Not so easy when the M25 is about 400yds away, and its a fairly flat area.
My cap fits perfectly, thank you, and it always has done over the years of stalking.
My aggressive response is also due to the fact that we have a banned member coming back on the site..................people must think we are stupid not to notice. They just cant help themselves. I remember when he hadn't been stalking very long and bought his BMH bitch down to West Sussex. Maybe I'm wrong in my assumption ? i would be surprised though if I am.
big ears
Well-Known Member
Sorry malc I am not a banned member who is returning so why aggressive towards me?
sikamalc
Administrator
Its not you, so don't worry.
big ears
Well-Known Member
I’ll take that as an apology then, thank you
Heym SR20
Well-Known Member
Be careful what you all wish for. Up here in Scotland there are areas where there are now very few deer. On my own permissions in Fife I didn’t see a single buck last year and took two does. And we normally several a year of both bucks and does.
Over in Argyl where I also regularly stalk we saw and took the only two stags on the ground. That place used to support 10 stags a year.
Neighbouring estates had to turn away several tens of thousands of pounds from overseas stalkers because there were no deer for them to stalk.
And the local contractors are now loosing money as they are getting very few deer and the larder fees are hardly covering the diesel costs.
Over in Argyl where I also regularly stalk we saw and took the only two stags on the ground. That place used to support 10 stags a year.
Neighbouring estates had to turn away several tens of thousands of pounds from overseas stalkers because there were no deer for them to stalk.
And the local contractors are now loosing money as they are getting very few deer and the larder fees are hardly covering the diesel costs.
I think you underestimate how much control the government has over the way people manage their land, and what they can or cannot do on that land.Midlands......
But again if the landowners don't want them shot, there's little to be done. And if anyone on here has permission, they had better sort it out. So its not the stalkers problem, its the landowners. How many times do we see Youtube video of large numbers of Fallow running across roads. So who owns the grounds?? may be someone does stalk the area, possibly not ? I agree areas such as this need hitting hard.
Again I will say, that some of the stupid comments on here seem to be aimed at professional stalkers. If anyone thinks that full time stalkers are the cause of over population they are kidding themselves. Yes, there are people who have many acres, 10,000 plus or more, that are only recreational, or make a few quid at a weekend, but don't tar everyone with the same brush.
With regard to pest control, landowners are already compelled to control rabbits, rats and certain weeds, for example. Whether or not this is properly enforced is another matter, but if it is then landowner has no choice in the matter.
There is already mention of a "deer management element" in the latest round of agri-environment support schemes, so that's just one step short of compulsory reduction in numbers.
With individual fallow herds numbering in the thousands in some areas, it's going to happen.
baguio
Well-Known Member
Those fallow have been shot hard all winter but as with all fallow herds, getting them back in hand will take a few seasons of hard work..
The numbers in the Midlands are much higher.
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